Luck, don't buy into it.

VaderSS

Skill Seeker
Ok, I'll admit that luck is something that plays a part in our lives. The problem is that most people give far too much control over to "luck."

In the arena of motorcycling, when we crash, we often say we were unlucky, but more often than not, if we look at it closely, we were at least partially at fault. I'd much rather be able to say that something was 100% at fault in a non-accident than to be able to console myself with the fact that I was only 5% at fault in an accident.

I've probably crashed a street-bike more than 90% of the riders here. I could have avoided every single one of those crashes with minimal effort.

Luck should only play a role, in our riding, when it comes to things like weather, road conditions, and the actions of others. Luck should not play more than a very small role in how we deal with the challenges that the road throws at us.

If a deer leaps out of the woods right on top of us, that is bad luck. Few other things in motorcycling occur with that little warning, and we should be prepared to deal with those things.

The most common cause for single vehicle motorcycle accidents is rider error. Read that again. Let it sink in. The most common rider error, in my opinion, is giving up on a situation before it is over and done. If you think you can make it, you'll have a heck of a lot better chance of actually making it than if you decide you can't make it. Once you make the decision that you've exhausted your options, you have. If you leave yourself open for another solution to pop up, then it probably will.

Personally, I'd rather be looking for another solution to the problem at hand, as I crash the bike. In most accidents though, we don't do that. We think, on a very deep level, "I'm screwed!" and a moment later we are. That realization that we are screwed causes panic, and panic causes the very thing we feared.

The panic mode, or "fight or flight" mode is an overpowering emotional blast that can save your life in certain circumstances where you have no previous experience to draw on. "Fight or flight" will kill you as quickly as a bullet to the heart, on a motorcycle.

The quickest way to engage "fight or flight" mode on a motorcycle, is to encounter a situation you had not planned for and have no escape already programmed in. In that situation, it is very common for the rider to; not lean as far as possible; target fixate, thus ensuring a collision with the very object of fear; over-brake and drop the bike, or some combination of the three.

The best way to avoid "fight or flight" is to have planned for as many possible situations as possible, and to have practiced the techniques required to avoid them.

A skilled motorcyclist is prepared for almost any eventuality. "Prepared" does not mean anticipating though. It is impossible to anticipate every eventuality, and trying will only cause you to miss what actually happens. "Prepared" means that you have considered the possibilities, came up with solutions for the problems, and practiced the solutions.

You might think of something that you "think" is impossible to prepare for, but that is when you should seek outside help. You may currently not have a tool to allow you to deal with something you think of, but the tool may exist and others can share it with you. Accept that, sometimes, it may require training to get the new tool and the skill to use it. Read some books. Discuss.

I am a firm believer in ATGATT for several reasons. The obvious one is that it protects us if we fall. Another benefit is that it allows us to practice another rule of life that will take you far;

Care, but not too much This is my number one rule for everything I do in life. I can't say that I manage it all the time, but I try.

In motorcycling, "Care, but not too much" means this; recognize the risks and prepare for them, but don't give them so much weight that they paralyze you. ATGATT goes a long way toward making this possible. Being prepared will help keep you from using the gear.
 

gambit45

Hot Hands
Good post:thumbup

My eyes are scanning constantly while riding but when something does happen I try not to react with sudden movements that will make it worse. Something I learned from racing oval track in cars.
 

corrupt

meat cleaver
People who rely too much on luck or are quick to blame others don't last long on motorcycles.
 

corrupt

meat cleaver
I credit luck for still being alive.

I just don't like to rely too much on luck... it's a fickle and flakey bitch.
 
I know a guy that has been riding for 30 years without an accident and he will tell you luck has 0 to do with it. I agree with him. He looks at the variables and decides what to do from there
 

VaderSS

Skill Seeker
My eyes are scanning constantly while riding ...

Vision is a much overlooked tool in our arsenal. We all know the "Look where you want to go," but it goes beyond that.

In some of the worst situations I've been in, if I could go to a "floodlight" vision mode, as opposed to a "spot" vision mode, I usually came out ok. It lessens the sense of speed and lets one see the possibilities. You know where the danger is, you don't need to look directly at it to know where it is, and looking directly at it will lead you right to it...

Some of my closest calls have been the result of of target fixation and only moving my eyes to the place I want to go, or switching to "flood" vision saved me.
 
good thread and agree for most part but GaryJ had a thread on guys that never crashed. He had a very cool list regarding not crashing.....
 
ah found it in 1Rider section .... heres for all those NON crashing guys :twofinger


How to achieve "I've been riding for XX (lots!) years - w/no crashes" bragging status

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The topic of "crashing" is one that will forever be with us in the world of motorcycle forum discussions. I'm OK with that, as I realize that the laws of physics demand a 2-wheel vehicle to "fall over", unless acted upon by sufficient gyroscopic effects (or a good kickstand ).

Despite this recognition, I'm a strong proponent to riders not taking the mindset that "crashing's OK", to the point that they begin to get lazy in the quest to develop every possible tool in their riding arsenal, and riding decision-making process, to prevent crashes from happening ...... street or track.

Having been on the underside of a motorcycle more than a few times over the last 20 years/300,000 miles of combined street riding and racetrack riding/racing, I'm no virgin. Still being healthy enough to continue these activities at a high level, I'm very grateful, and also not ashamed of my crash stats.

What prompted this thread was the posts that invariably appear (thankfully only from a few individuals) in any discussion on the topic of the inevitability of every rider evenutally crashing. Posts from these "perfect" riders, typically carry a boastful message along the lines of: "I've been riding for 30 years, and have never crashed". The projected message sometimes comes across in a "holier than thou" form, giving the impression of a rating system where any individual that has crashed, must therefore be a lesser skilled/experienced rider. In looking at things from a real world perspective, gotta call this BS.

Thinking about the recipe that would most likely have to be applied to the riding history of anyone honestly being able to proclaim a "30 years riding and never crashed once" record, I figured I'd put together a "how to" list that might be useful for newer riders to follow, if their goal is to someday achieve such immortal status in the motorcycle community. Here's my list. Feel free to add to it, if you have any secrets of your own.

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Things to do to achieve: "I've been riding for 30 years and never crashed" status on the forums:

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1. Apply "Selective Amnesia", where you don't remember (count) all those times the bike and you ended up on the ground (dirt or pavement), because you didn't get hurt, and damage to the bike was minor.

2. Skip large numbers of years, by not actually owning/riding a motorcycle, during the 30 year period.

3. Ride only a few hundred miles/year, during many of the years of the 30 year period, to keep the contiguous riding string in tact.

4. Never ride when weather and/or road conditions aren't absolutely "perfect".

5. Consistently resist temptation to recognize the potential to "have fun" (speed, cornering, jumping, etc.), when riding a motorcycle.

6. Absolutely avoid all forms of "recreational use" riding of your motorcycles.

7. Only ride on large super-slab freeways/highways (great for logging big mileage numbers for "no crash" bragging rights).

8. Never participate in any form of organized competition (dirt or pavement) on a motorcycle.

9. Never ride a motorcycle in the dirt.

10. Lie a lot and hide behind your avatar, as no one knows who you are in real life anyways (because no one ever sees you riding), so they can't dispute your "zero crash" record.

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Just a little Wednesday truth and humor ............. FWIW.

Gary J

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Jasepaste

Well-known member
Vision is a much overlooked tool in our arsenal.

One thing I didn't really pay attention to when trying on helmets was the different peripheral view's they offered. I went from a Shoei TZR to a Arai Quantum II and I feel like I can see less out of the corner of my eye.
 

ST Guy

Well-known member
Good post! Too many people in this world blame something else for their problems. It might be the reason they crashed, why they lost their job, why their relationship didn't work out, etc., etc. They bumble through life, expecting that they will be safe and happy and everything will work out dandy with very minimal effort on their part. And they are confused, angry, and indignant when things go wrong.

Getting through life happily with minimal disappointment takes care and attention to detail. Anthing less and disappointment is what you get.
 

VaderSS

Skill Seeker
MotardJunkie, my philosophy covers crashes as well.

If I crash, I don't feel that it is "Ok," but I also don't feel that it was inevitable, or that it was the end of the world.

If I crash, unless it wwas because of a part falling off an aircraft or something of that nature, it is likely that I was doing something I should not have. I probably did whatever I was doing hundreds, if not thousands of times before, and got away with it. I was rolling the dice, either aware or unaware, but still rolling the dice.

The problem with a crash is that it is very easy to come to the wrong conclusion as to what caused it, or to decide that the cause it is impossible to plan for.

I found out last weekend that I've been rolling the dice almost every time I take a curve, for my entire life. A crash would probably not have told me that. It took a highly educated Mentor with decades of experience to let me know. He followed me for a few minutes, pulled me over, and let me know. The best part was that it was free.

That is where expert instruction comes in. Self-evaluation is a very poor tool, in many instances.
 

VaderSS

Skill Seeker
Good post! Too many people in this world blame something else for their problems. It might be the reason they crashed, why they lost their job, why their relationship didn't work out, etc., etc. They bumble through life, expecting that they will be safe and happy and everything will work out dandy with very minimal effort on their part. And they are confused, angry, and indignant when things go wrong.

Getting through life happily with minimal disappointment takes care and attention to detail. Anthing less and disappointment is what you get.

ST Guy. Bingo, you get it.

The most liberating thing anyone can do is to take full responsibility for their lot in life. Stop blaming others. They may be at fault for some of my problems, but I am my own worst enemy, and I can get past most roadblocks with patient persistance and education. The best revenge is a life well lived...

Of course, there are folks who have serious issues that they had nothing to do with, but these people often live a much better life than you would expect them to.
 

Nemo Brinker

Tonight we ride
Good post.
Primarily locating control within myself, as opposed to believing that control is primarily in external factors, has been one of the most useful tools I've gotten out of motorcycling.

Reminds me that I could use more mentoring and external observation myself, too. Vader, would you care to share what your mentor observed and suggested?
 

VaderSS

Skill Seeker
Vader, would you care to share what your mentor observed and suggested?

I was using maintenance throttle or "coasting" through turns. He teaches trail-braking as an intermidiate skill. Should be learned after a rider is comfortable with the bike, but before the rider starts to go fast in the twisties.

I need to make a disclaimer right here and say that one SHOULD NOT try to learn trail-braking on the street, and should also NOT use my limited description to attempt learning it. I initially picked it up from the Total Control book, and did a lot of guided practice at the Total Control ARC Level 2. The first time I tried an evasion with it, if I had been on the street, I would have run off the road or into oncoming traffic to the INSIDE of my turn. It took quite a few tries to get it right... The first time I tried practicing an evasion with it on the street, I again almost ran out of my lane to the inside, AND I KNEW WHAT TO EXPECT! Also, each bike will react in a different way. I can do things with my Wing that would likely cause a crash on a sport-bike... Do not think that, because you are a natural at other things on a bike that you can pick up trail-braking in the same way. I am a quick study and it was a steep learning curve...

The summary is as follows;

Basically, if I can't see the exit of the turn, I should be lightly on the brakes or engine braking with the brake covered. Once I see the exit, I should then trail off the brake and roll on the throttle, assuming it is safe to do so.

Once one masters trail-braking, it gives the rider a tool to deal with suprises in corners. If you are on the brakes, a little extra brake is a non-issue(assuming you are not using all of your traction "pie" for cornering, which you should not be, on the street) and allows you to tighten your line while slowing, which allows you to stand the bike up and brake harder or evade.

If you are not on the brakes in a corner, and you get a suprise, then it takes about a full second to react and get meaningful braking. At that point, the geometry and tire load is changing radically and its very likely the bike will stand up and run right into what you want to avoid. This contrasts with adding brake to existing trail-brake, where the suspension and tire are alredy loaded and there is no shock to the system.

Basically, trail-braking gives you a powerful tool in a realm where you once had few options to deal with suprises. As with most powerful tools, its misuse can burn you.
 
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