Stop Light Changes (did a search, and called my local department)

[sasquatch]

21450.5. (a) A traffic-actuated signal is an official traffic
control signal, as specified in Section 445, that displays one or
more of its indications in response to the presence of traffic
detected by mechanical, visual, electrical, or other means.
(b) Upon the first placement of a traffic-actuated signal or
replacement of the loop detector of a traffic-actuated signal, the
traffic-actuated signal shall, to the extent feasible and in
conformance with professional traffic engineering practice, be
installed and maintained so as to detect lawful bicycle or motorcycle
traffic on the roadway.
If it is there and it does not detect you is is not operating correctly.

 

[OldFatGuy]

This subparagraph shall apply to traffic control signals that become inoperative because of battery failure.

Well, it doesn't say, "This subparagraph shall apply ONLY to traffic control signals that become inoperative because of battery failure."

:dunno

 

[Traq]

Posed this question to a local LEO down here (fresno); his response was that 21800(d)(1) doesn't apply to our situation, based on the last sentence of the section, and that they love giving these tickets at night.

Thoughts? Also, I wonder how this (either view) would stand up in a real court situation.

So did you ask him what was legally required at signals that were out due to power failure? Cause he just argued that you don't have to stop at lights that are out unless they were battery operated lights. :rolleyes

 

[tgrrdr]

CVC 21450.5.
(b) Upon the first placement of a traffic-actuated signal or replacement of the loop detector of a traffic-actuated signal, the traffic-actuated signal shall, to the extent feasible and in conformance with professional traffic engineering practice, be installed and maintained so as to detect lawful bicycle or motorcycle traffic on the roadway.

If it is there and it does not detect you is is not operating correctly.

This only applies to new or modified signals. 21450.5 was added to the CVC by AB 1581 which became law January 1, 2008. The regulation implementing this requirement was promulgated by the Department of Transportation in September 2009 and it only applies to signals installed (or loop detectors replaced) after the effective date of the regulation. You can try to use this section as your basis for arguing the signal was non-operative but I wouldn't count on it working for an "old" signal. YMMV. :ride

 

[what]

There are a few broken loops in my area - if there are no other cars around to trip the light I usually just put down the kickstand, walk over and press the pedestrian crossing button. That trips the signal.

 

[serazin]

There are a few broken loops in my area - if there are no other cars around to trip the light I usually just put down the kickstand, walk over and press the pedestrian crossing button. That trips the signal.

Where I live, public works stated, in an article in the newspaper about 5 years ago, that only about 30% of the pedestrian crossing buttons are actually wired. Everything is on timers and the buttons are there just to give the pedestrians something to do.

 

[Traq]

There are a few broken loops in my area - if there are no other cars around to trip the light I usually just put down the kickstand, walk over and press the pedestrian crossing button. That trips the signal.

You abandon your running motor vehicle in the middle of the road and walk across live lanes of traffic..................and you think this is a good idea? :facepalm

 

[deathbug74]

Where I live, public works stated, in an article in the newspaper about 5 years ago, that only about 30% of the pedestrian crossing buttons are actually wired. Everything is on timers and the buttons are there just to give the pedestrians something to do.

:wtf

You abandon your running motor vehicle in the middle of the road and walk across live lanes of traffic..................and you think this is a good idea? :facepalm

i'm pretty sure this is in the context of those dead times of day (or night) where "live" is a relative term for those empty lanes. any other time, and there'd be someone (automotive) coming along to trip the light.

 

[summitdog]

Depending on the traffic conditions, I have jumped off the bike before and triggered the pedestrian crossing button. Especially when I see a LEO sitting on a side street waiting for me to cross the red light.

 

[what]

You abandon your running motor vehicle in the middle of the road and walk across live lanes of traffic..................and you think this is a good idea? :facepalm

When you assume you make an ass out of you.

I pull up in the righthand lane, probably about 3' from the button. It's a broken stoplight in a residential/business area, not a highway. If there were any cars on my side of the street I wouldn't have to press the button in the first place.

It's a hellofa lot safer than crossing an intersection against the signal.

 

[Whodat]

It's a broken stoplight in a residential/business area, not a highway. If there were any cars on my side of the street I wouldn't have to press the button in the first place.
.

If it's a broken stoplight why don't you just treat it as a stop sign and proceed when safe like it says in the DMV book?

 

[what]

If it's a broken stoplight why don't you just treat it as a stop sign and proceed when safe like it says in the DMV book?

Because crossing lawrence expressway or other large roads against the light is not safe, period. And it is very, very easy to press the button.

 

[Traq]

When you assume you make an ass out of you.

The only assumption I made was that you didn't shut the bike off first. Everything else was precisely what you wrote. :rolleyes

 

[what]

The only assumption I made was that you didn't shut the bike off first. Everything else was precisely what you wrote. :rolleyes

Except for the part about 1) abandoning 2) middle of road and 3) live lanes of traffic. Hey, at least you got the facepalm right - that was almost prescient

 

[Traq]

Except for the part about 1) abandoning 2) middle of road and 3) live lanes of traffic. Hey, at least you got the facepalm right - that was almost prescient

Your failure to grasp basic definitions of words is not my problem. I restated exactly what you said using accurate terminology for your actions.

 

[ScottRNelson]

Depending on the traffic conditions, I have jumped off the bike before and triggered the pedestrian crossing button. Especially when I see a LEO sitting on a side street waiting for me to cross the red light.

I've ridden my XR650L up onto the sidewalk to press the button, then backed down into my lane again.

Which of these two methods is less likely to get you in trouble?

 

[what]

I've ridden my XR650L up onto the sidewalk to press the button, then backed down into my lane again.

Which of these two methods is less likely to get you in trouble?

My reasoning has been that pulling to the side of the road and getting off your bike is pretty much always a defensible action when faced with an unsafe situation.

As far as I can tell at worst you're on the hook for is a parking violation if you block the crosswalk or bike lane.

 

[ScottRNelson]

As far as I can tell at worst you're on the hook for is a parking violation if you block the crosswalk or bike lane.

Okay, but if there were anyone to block on the crosswalk or bike lane I would just ask them if they could hit the button for me. This only happens when there is NOBODY around, but usually when I need to cross streets with lots of lanes where there might be enough traffic coming the other way that I don't feel it's safe to run the light - but still nobody coming my way to set off the sensors.

 

[what]

I'm not saying I think a ticket in that situation would be reasonable, only that as far as I can tell it would be possible (I'd love to hear a professional opinion on this one). Riding up on the sidewalk is, I imagine, potentially some sort of moving violation with a larger penalty than stopping to the side.

I don't think either action is particularly egregious, but I'd feel more confident in front of a judge explaining pulling to the right and getting off. Riding up on the sidewalk sounds like fun, and judges in my experience do not like fun.

 

[pennyinmypocket]

Thumbs Up

This Thread gets 2 thumbs up, I've been asking all around for the answer to the Red Light question. It seems common sense to treat it as a stop sign and In my opinion it's kind of ridiculous for an officer to ticket a Biker (specifically) if there is no one else around. Are laws not in place specifically for safety and not to inconvenience us?