What will it take to convince you of climate change?

S

Schnellbandit

I see 4 lights!
UDRider said:
The land mass is increasing due to increased sediment deposit, and highlights the fact that island mass is a dynamic mechanism, but let's not facts get in a way of yet another SQUIRREL moment from you.
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Everyone already knows that, it was in all the articles. Hello?

Isn't it true that there were claims made the islands would be among the first to experience the effects of rising sea levels in a negative way and held up to highlight those effects? Why yes, there were.

What the fear mongers failed to do was even bother with finding out if anyone was studying the increasing land mass or consider increasing land mass, regardless of why, before they started yapping about rising sea levels. Failing that, they never bothered to look at photos that clearly showed the islands weren't being swallowed up by rising seas, oceans or the draining of bathrubs.

Oh, they knew, they just hoped no one else would bother to look.
 
UDRider

UDRider

FLCL?
Schnellbandit said:
Everyone already knows that, it was in all the articles. Hello?

Isn't it true that there were claims made the islands would be among the first to experience the effects of rising sea levels in a negative way and held up to highlight those effects? Why yes, there were.

What the fear mongers failed to do was even bother with finding out if anyone was studying the increasing land mass or consider increasing land mass, regardless of why, before they started yapping about rising sea levels. Failing that, they never bothered to look at photos that clearly showed the islands weren't being swallowed up by rising seas, oceans or the draining of bathrubs.

Oh, they knew, they just hoped no one else would bother to look.
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You never mentioned it in your original post, so not sure if you read past the headline, or just missrepresented. Thus my original post.
Rest Squirrel!
 
S

Schnellbandit

I see 4 lights!
CoorsLight said:
Doesn't this just defuse your entire argument?
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No. There is no argument being made.

Sea levels are rising. The land mass of the islands increased.

Climate change exists.

Now, what your positions seems to be along with some others is that I deny climate change when that is factually not true.

Read the title of the OP. What does it take.... Right? That is the question.

So, if you were trying to convince someone VW bugs were slow would you hold up as evidence a VW with a porsche engine it that rips 0-60 in 5 seconds flat and then explain that the stock one gets to 60 in a minute and a half?:laughing

The climate change megaphones were blasting stories about those islands and how they would be under water along with the usual, what about those poor people... right?

So what happens to that with this published study that will be used by the likes of Breitbat and all the others seeking to discredit the fact of rising sea levels? Now comes the explaination that its washing up seashells or whatever. Sorry, once you have to walk back stuff like this people question everything else being claimed.

Instead of trying to shore up a fiasco of a claim in the way it was promoted to the public, try this on:

You know, the idiots that decided to use those islands as an example sure screwed the pooch on that one. Then at least the posts following the article wouldn't look like a bigger denial that those denying climate change. As ot is, it looks like the throwing out of cannon fodder to excuse a PR disaster because those trying to convince others of climate change will say anything and hope they aren't found out to be shills.

Sadly, this goof by those selling climate change isn't unique and the backwalking and excusing comes up all the time.
 
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scootergmc

scootergmc

old and slow
Gabe said:
Here are my closing thoughts, and then maybe a mod can close this thread:

It's not your fault any more than it is mine. If climate change caused by global warming is the result of human activity, then all of us who live in a resource-consuming society like ours is responsible. It doesn't really matter who you vote for, what kind of car you drive or even if you're a vegetarian.

Even teg916, who lives for saying shit to make liberals mad, agrees that climate change is human caused, at least to some extent.. I guess I see the point that we don't know how much, but I think everyone agrees it's more than enough to fuck shit up on a global scale. Arguing about the degree of human impact is like arguing about how much punching an elderly person contributes to their death.

So now I ask you two things: what's the worst thing that will happen if I'm wrong compared to what's the worst thing that will happen if you're wrong?

And finally, if denying there's a problem IS the problem, why don't you want to be part of the solution?

Drops mike.
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Picks up mic?
 
byke

byke

Well-known member
Unfortunately, the American brain, or lack thereof, is such that people will have ten kids just to spite the discussion of population control.
 
Butch

Butch

poseur
Staff member
nakedape said:
The premise was false in the population bomb book. We didn't run out of food like predicted. Gross oversimplification of course.
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Ok, engage...
The discussion I was thinking of was about the challenge to meet the food energy resource demands of an ever increasing population. That, and the economic model of consumption.

I kinda think this is the root that needs to be addressed.
I dunno.
 
T

TylerW

Agitator
Covid-19, and the country's response to it, is a beautiful microcosm of the country's response to climate change: individualism vs. collective benefit.

Many individuals in this country won't do a goddamn thing to benefit others if it means a mild inconvenience to themselves.
 
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Gabe

Gabe

COVID-fefe
Butch said:
Ok, engage...
The discussion I was thinking of was about the challenge to meet the food energy resource demands of an ever increasing population. That, and the economic model of consumption.

I kinda think this is the root that needs to be addressed.
I dunno.
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1. As the world develops economically, the population rate will slow and eventually stabilize or even reverse. Good discussion here: https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/20...rated-concern-climate-change-world-population

2. Even if what you say is true, why can't we address both problems?
 
M

mlm

Contrarian
TylerW said:
Covid-19, and the country's response to it, is a beautiful microcosm of the country's response to climate change: individualism vs. collective benefit.

Many individuals in this country won't do a goddamn thing to benefit others if it means a mild inconvenience to themselves.
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Don't forget the fear of being called a <dogma>-ist !
 
nakedape

nakedape

Well-known member
Gabe said:
1. As the world develops economically, the population rate will slow and eventually stabilize or even reverse. Good discussion here: https://www.vox.com/the-big-idea/20...rated-concern-climate-change-world-population

2. Even if what you say is true, why can't we address both problems?
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Good article. Soil management has somewhat improved but monoculture is not only pissing away soil fertility but destroying the carbon capturing abilities it once had.

The current generation is looking at reduced life expectancy. For the first time in many decades. I have classes of 36 where 30 are flagged for health alerts including asthma and diabetes. We created food deserts in communities of color and are busy creating actual desertification on what was once prime farmland. The central valley has subsided 30'+ since the thirties.

Side note is current admin is paying big ag big subsidies with incredibly destructive and chemically intensive practices while responsible and local small farmers get little to nothing. The fucking Farm Act needs major revisions, but farm lobby has a uniquely strong position in congress. We can do better, but we won't.
 
Gabe

Gabe

COVID-fefe
nakedape said:
Good article. Soil management has somewhat improved but monoculture is not only pissing away soil fertility but destroying the carbon capturing abilities it once had.

The current generation is looking at reduced life expectancy. For the first time in many decades. I have classes of 36 where 30 are flagged for health alerts including asthma and diabetes. We created food deserts in communities of color and are busy creating actual desertification on what was once prime farmland. The central valley has subsided 30'+ since the thirties.

Side note is current admin is paying big ag big subsidies with incredibly destructive and chemically intensive practices while responsible and local small farmers get little to nothing. The fucking Farm Act needs major revisions, but farm lobby has a uniquely strong position in congress. We can do better, but we won't.
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I think things are nearing a tipping point. At this point the ENTIRE WORLD is on board with the climate change agenda, except for the 30 percent of the US public that has, frankly, gone insane.

But when 99% of the world is against you, even that much of the US voting public can't stave off the inevitable. People are really seeing the effects of this and are PISSED. Rolling coal is doomed.
 
Eldritch

Eldritch

is insensitive
Gabe said:
I think things are nearing a tipping point. At this point the ENTIRE WORLD is on board with the climate change agenda, except for the 30 percent of the US public that has, frankly, gone insane.

But when 99% of the world is against you, even that much of the US voting public can't stave off the inevitable. People are really seeing the effects of this and are PISSED. Rolling coal is doomed.
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What Nonsense are you spewing that this is an America problem? We are clearly doing our part. We are not even close to the number one producer, with China having twice the Carbon footprint we do, and we aren't even in the top 3 for Carbon Footprint Per Capita.

https://www.ucsusa.org/resources/each-countrys-share-co2-emissions

It is a global problem, certainly, but to suggest the U.S. is not doing their part is absurd.
 
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