Steering bearing problem..

[czabelin]

Hello all,

So today I changed out my steering bearings on my 04 CBR600rr and after everything was put back together I took it our for a ride. As I was riding I noticed the bike was wobbling from left to right. It feels like its pulling down on the clip-ons. Slow speeds are worse. Turning also feels a bit choppy.

Installed tapered bearings, torqued everything down correctly except the steering stem nut. I didn't have the correct tool so i took a punch and hammered it tight. While the forks were off they got knocked over (not sure of thats relevant), other than that everything was done correctly. After I came back from the test ride I took the entire front suspension off and reassembled it. Still have the problem.

Any suggestions on what it could be and how to fix it?

 

[CBR1000RR09]

How did u change out the race on the steering stem from roller bearing to taper? Did u have a shop press off the race and press a new one on?

As for the wobble handling the bearings need to be seated then retorque but if u took it apart and reassembled then I would doubt that could be the problem. That steering stem locknut should be around 18 ft lbs. That's the nut that a spanner wrench fits on....

 

[CBR1000RR09]

Were you particular when u re installed the forks to set ur fork height after u put on the top triple, tighten the lower pinch, snug up top pinch, hand tighten top nut as much as possible by hand, then torque to spec. Torque top pinch top spec and u should be straight

 

[Hooli]

Was the top nut ever torqued to recommended settings? Tapered roller bearings are a bit more sensitive to torque settings than the standard ball bearings, due to their increased surface area.

 

[Stormdragon]

I didn't have the correct tool so i took a punch and hammered it tight.

I'd hazard a guess at that being the problem. I was always taught to tighten the bearings down until the triples didn't drop to a side freely( no forks) and then back off until they did drop freely. Then reinstall the forks.

In other words, I'm betting you got the bearings too tight.

 

[kgmoto]

Ok, the adjusting nut (the lower of the two spanner nuts) is torqued to 22 ft/lbs, seated, and retorqued to 35 ft/lbs. The lock nut is "hand tightened to seat, and rotated ~90 degress till lock washer tabs line up". So, nothing on the front end is 18 ft/lbs.... The adjusting nut is to be installed with lubricated threads, so the true torque is even higher than the measured torque. I would definitely go through this sequence again and make sure it is all correct. The upper clamp nut is torqued to 76 ft/lbs.

Im curious how you went to tapered bearings too, and were the races properly pressed in/out? Using anything other than OEM bearing/races would probably alter the recommended torques. Oh, and a punch is for removing things you aren't going to reuse. Please go get a spanner wrench, or hire someone with the tools and previous experience. I think its pretty obvious its not safe to be riding on something with a front end wobbling around.

 

[WeekEndWarrior]

opcorn

 

[teg916]

Hello all,

So today I changed out my steering bearings on my 04 CBR600rr and after everything was put back together I took it our for a ride. As I was riding I noticed the bike was wobbling from left to right. It feels like its pulling down on the clip-ons. Slow speeds are worse. Turning also feels a bit choppy.

Installed tapered bearings, torqued everything down correctly except the steering stem nut. I didn't have the correct tool so i took a punch and hammered it tight. While the forks were off they got knocked over (not sure of thats relevant), other than that everything was done correctly. After I came back from the test ride I took the entire front suspension off and reassembled it. Still have the problem.

Any suggestions on what it could be and how to fix it?

I can all but guarantee you over-torqued the steering stem nut. Assuming you didn't damage the bearing if you loosen it up a bit everything should go back to normal. If you don't have the right tool to torque it, then lift the front of the bike in a way that lets you steer the handlebars without anything dragging them down. Tighten the nut until you feel some drag when moving the bars side to side(that is probably where you are now) then loosen the steering stem nut just enough for the drag to go away.

 

[CBR1000RR09]

Oh I was giving you an estimated spec on the adjustment locknut which for an F4i is 18 ft lbs. I can't imagine it being much different not to mention twice the torque amount. I have done a lot of steering stem work and 35 ft seems a bit high but I will verify that. The top triple locknut is the same at 76 ft lbs so those are the same. I am gonna check but 35 ft lbs seems like the wrong spec as someone stated previously...brb

 

[CBR1000RR09]

Kgmoto---
you are very wrong, no offense but 35 ft lbs for that locknut is absolutely ridiculous. Check your specs again!

Op-Year would be great!

 

[Hooli]

Op-Year would be great!

So today I changed out my steering bearings on my 04 CBR600rr...

:eboy

 

[kgmoto]

From the 03-04 600RR FSM... oops, I was 1 ft/lb over spec.
Im a little surprised everyones saying OVER tightened, I'd think wobble = loose, but, I don't have a lot of steering stem experience. I also dont know what "pulling down on the clipons" feels like. Can you elaborate OP?

 

[Ironbutt]

There's two sets of preload- if you will.. inside and top

if both upper and lower trees are loose.. tighten the first ring down -do the fall away test and then loosen it.. tighten it some more, loosen it and then finally tighten it down. Then tighten the trees-tube clamps up. then finally tighten down the big nut that goes on top of all that. -Do the fall away test again. Front end must be in the air. Tubes must be loose and forks allowed to float.

The fall away test is described in the HD repair manuals and it works great.

Basically you put a chair in front of the bike and push the bars side to side. If the front falls and bounces twice it's too loose. If if goes slowly, it's too tight.. also helps to check binding of cables.

Hello all,

So today I changed out my steering bearings on my 04 CBR600rr and after everything was put back together I took it our for a ride. As I was riding I noticed the bike was wobbling from left to right. It feels like its pulling down on the clip-ons. Slow speeds are worse. Turning also feels a bit choppy.

Installed tapered bearings, torqued everything down correctly except the steering stem nut. I didn't have the correct tool so i took a punch and hammered it tight. While the forks were off they got knocked over (not sure of thats relevant), other than that everything was done correctly. After I came back from the test ride I took the entire front suspension off and reassembled it. Still have the problem.

Any suggestions on what it could be and how to fix it?

 

[ST Guy]

Wobble is a fairly rapid left/right motion. If by "wobble" you mean that it doesn't want to track back to straight after a curve, or if you push on one end of the bar and the the bike wants to stay that way and not go straight again when you release the pressure, then the bearings are too tight.

Here's how I adjusted my tapered roller bearings in the steering stem:

1. Make absolutely sure that the races are fully seated.
2. Overtorque the bearings somewhat to assure that they are fully seated and there's no grease or anything holding them apart. Turn the bars left and right and there should be some noticable (read too much) drag.
3. Back off on the adjustment until it's free and then slowly tighten until there's only just too much drag. This is subjective but one measure is that the forks won't flop over to one side of the other if you give them a little push off of center. Then make a mark on the adjusting nut and then a mark that aligns with it on some stationary part of the upper triple clamp or maybe the tab washer under the nut.
4. Back off on the adjustment nut until there is obvious play in the bearings. Then slowly tighten the nut down until all play is only just eliminated. Tugging on the bottoms of the forks can help determine this point. Make another mark that designates this position of the nut.
5. Now simply adjust the nut so that it is halfway between just getting all the play out and just a hair too tight. Then snug up the locking nut.

 

[czabelin]

Tomorrow Im going to be correctly torquing the steering stem nut and see what happens. If nothing changes I will be taking everything apart again and reassembling properly. Thanks for all the input

 

[Z3n]

Sometimes the torque specs for steering head bearings are WAY off when you check the repair manual. As in, the bike won't steer way off. They can also be difficult to seat correctly, as sometimes the bearing will hang up on one side or another. Use the fall test to see if they're installed correctly, you should also have smooth action with the front end off the ground, if you can feel any roughness or vibration in them, there's something wrong.

Finally, did you get new races put in for the tapered bearings? If you didn't swap in new races for the tapered bearings, then you're going to have all kinds of weird steering characteristics.

 

[kingmoochr]

Is the fall test done with the full front end installed? I assume off the ground. Iron butt, what is the purpose of the chair?

 

[Z3n]

Is the fall test done with the full front end installed? I assume off the ground. Iron butt, what is the purpose of the chair?

For him to sit in while he watches the forks fall to the side? :laughing

I like watching it from the top.

It can be done with the full front end installed, but you want to make sure that you're not getting any binding or resistance from the cables or controls.

 

[Ironbutt]

Is the fall test done with the full front end installed? I assume off the ground. Iron butt, what is the purpose of the chair?

Yes- and front wheel off the ground.

the chair is for sitting.. :laughing

--it's for the tape.. instead of a stand, I use a chair. Obviously the recommended fasll away distance is different on different bikes and then again, this isn't used at all except for HD. But it's how I do it. Pretty cool way to do it.


Everyone bags on HD but did you know they include how to lace a wheel?

I'll paraphrase from the manual.

Fall away procedure suggested for HD XL models.

1. front wheel off the ground.
2. remove cables that bind up free movement of front end
3. install masking tape on fender -center
4. install pointer mounted to floor stand -pointer is mounted center of fender.<the chair>
5. repeatedly nudge fender a short distance on one side until the front end begins to 'fall away' by itself. mark the point on the take where the wheel starts to fall away. Repeat in opposite direction
6. measure the distance between the two fall away points- the distance must be 1-2 inches
7. if not the correct distance, adjust the jam nutz under the top triple clamp.

So this tells you the bearing needs a specific amount of 'preload' and it's not something you can just crank down upon. Well, you can.. but it won't feel good! :laughing

 

[kingmoochr]

So the fall test can be done with everything installed? Just check first with the top triple off, then again after it's back on?

Thanks for the writeup Iron Butt