School me on Lien title vehicles

[Jacare]

You know those times when you want to believe it its too good of a deal, almost to good to be true, so you want to check yourself? Yeah that's what I'm trying to do now, but my google searches haven't come out very successful so far. So I'm tuning to my fellow Barfians for guidance, wisdom, or just that slap in the face I need to come to my senses.

In my early days of having a drivers license I was introduced briefly to the idea of purchasing a car with a Lien title, I completely overlooked the idea because soon after I found my affordable dream car, settling for that. Now a few years wiser, and currently without a motorcycle, the idea was brought up again to find a two wheeled cycle to curb my desire. Don't care what bike, or if I need to wrench a little. I called up a few tow yrds, but they all give me the run around telling me it's way simple to just get the bike registered and ready to go. Is it really that simple to go in one day with a few hundred bucks and walk out a champion? The receptionist at the yard I just visited just told me they sold a 2011 Suzuki "fast bike" for 600. Now excluding the fact she didn't know the exact bike, that's a gold dealers, even for the most basic of bikes offered that year.


So what's the deal, why isn't everyone doing this. Someone either whip me into shape or give me some encouragement, since my other half isn't all for it

 

[NoTraffic]

The reason why everyone isn't doing it is because the risk is too high for the reward. Why?

1) You have to do all the legwork on paying back fees, getting the title in your name, working with DMV. Is your time worth that?

2) You have no idea what condition the bike is in. Bent frame, toasted engine, rusted out gas tank. . . Tow yards barely give you the time of day, let alone being able to come down, try to turn it over, etc. Plus, most tow yards TOW the bike - they do not have the key. That means you buy sight unseen plus have to figure out how to tow it back home with no key.

3) No key means you have to redo the ignition. That means more $$$.

Is all the above worth trying to save money? Maybe, but I would much rather buy a used bike in running order, allow a test ride, up-to-date reg., and all I have to do is do a transfer title.

Not worth it to me, your luck in spades.

 

[Cincinnatus]

Do it, take pics. Let us know how it goes.

Let your other half help.

We'll wait.

Oh, and when the divorce/separation is final, is she hawt?

In short, there's a reason nobody does it. Why take a trashed POS and spend $$$$$$ (your time is valuable, so's your SO's, right?), when you could buy a good bike from a BARFer and save all that anguish? :thumbup

 

[BlueScholar]

After seeing some of the lengths that BARFers will go through to save money, I am really surprised there are so many against liensales.


I worked for a salvage auction for a while and dealt with many-a-liened vehicle. They can be tricky but if you know what you are doing (or the tow yard does), it should be pretty straight forward assuming you don't get an Ahole at the DMV helping you..

Soooo, first things first, all information provided below is true to the best of my knowledge. HOWEVER, DMV requirements often change and I am no longer in this field of work. TO ANYONE WHO READS THIS, IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO KNOW WHAT YOU ARE BUYING AND THE LAWS, REGULATIONS AND PAPERWORK THAT WILL NEED TO BE INVOLVED.


There are a certain set of documents they must provide to you (the buyer) that shows they went through the proper lien process. Do not purchase anything without these documents (out of state lien packets will not be processed by CA DMV so don't let them sell you lien paperwork from any other state unless you want to go there and deal with their DMV. These docs change based on the vehicles title situations but, generally, here is what the DMV is looking for:

1- A CVR or similar report which shows the entire legal history of the vehicle (ie every owner, lienholder or registered driver). A CARFAX or similar will NOT do as they do not show all previous owners or mailing addresses. These are legal reports which are obtained through the DMV or CVR licensee.

2-MAKE SURE THE ABOVE REPORT DOES NOT SHOW A LIENHOLDER ON THE MOST RECENT TITLE. If there is no lienholder, proceed. If there is a lienholder, make sure they have a signed, notarized and stamped lien release from the exact lienholder, otherwise you will probably have one hell of a time obtaining it. If they do not have the release, you can try contacting the lienholder and asking if they will provide one to you, I would not purchase the bike until you receive that doc.

3- Adequate proof that they tried to contact all previous owners. This is usually 3 or more certified mailings to each previous owner. They must show that each PO was contacted and offered a chance to square up the debt and buy the car. A CA Reg 668 must be included in each of these letters.

4- Lien sale certification filled out by the tow yard/seller (reg 168A) stating they went through the lien process and now believe they can legally sell it (I believe they have to prove that the vehicle is worth less than $4000).



That is it for the straight forward (see: easy) lien sales. Like I said, there are a large variety of situations that can come up on the CVR which must be addressed (i.e. no owners come up, vehicle has no CA record, etc.).

The easiest way to think of a lien sale (or really any sort of ownership documents) is that it must read as a story with no breaks in the plot.

For example, if MR. A was the original owner and MR. B was the owner who had it towed, you have to see a release of liability on the CVR report or some sort of proof of payment before you can move on. It is VERY important to check the dates on the DMV report as well, since they may give you issues if the release of liability happened after Mr. B registered the vehicle (or a variety of other knit-picky BS).


Hopefully this helps but I would really recommend taking someone who knows the process with you or only work with shops you trust. If you get a copy of the paperwork (I believe they are required to provide it to you if you want to check it out), you can PM/email them to me and I'll take a look.

 

[mototireguy]

So what's the deal, why isn't everyone doing this.

You have to inspect the bike, know what parts are needed, bargain with shady tow/impound yards/employees, know exactly what documents should be offered/signed before you fork over any cash, install needed parts, fix electrical gremlins and know the ins/outs at the DMV.

Easy?

 

[Jacare]

The reason why everyone isn't doing it is because the risk is too high for the reward. Why?

1) You have to do all the legwork on paying back fees, getting the title in your name, working with DMV. Is your time worth that?

2) You have no idea what condition the bike is in. Bent frame, toasted engine, rusted out gas tank. . . Tow yards barely give you the time of day, let alone being able to come down, try to turn it over, etc. Plus, most tow yards TOW the bike - they do not have the key. That means you buy sight unseen plus have to figure out how to tow it back home with no key.

3) No key means you have to redo the ignition. That means more $$$.

Is all the above worth trying to save money? Maybe, but I would much rather buy a used bike in running order, allow a test ride, up-to-date reg., and all I have to do is do a transfer title.

Not worth it to me, your luck in spades.

Thank you. i appreciate the suggestions from you both. the biggest concern i have is what the title status would be, either clean or salvage, and what other fees can be brought up. any backed tickets that the vehicle has, violations, and how extensive the leg work is with the DMV

One tow yard only deals with cars and motorcycles that were confiscated while on the street, all by law enforcement. so everything is complete, and they include keys. al but one car had keys. At this particular yard, youre allowed to start up the vehicle, go in and inspect, but not allowed to remove from their little lot. so i cant go out and test ride it. i guess perks of living in a smaller town

 

[BlueScholar]

Thank you. i appreciate the suggestions from you both. the biggest concern i have is what the title status would be, either clean or salvage, and what other fees can be brought up. any backed tickets that the vehicle has, violations, and how extensive the leg work is with the DMV

One tow yard only deals with cars and motorcycles that were confiscated while on the street, all by law enforcement. so everything is complete, and they include keys. al but one car had keys. At this particular yard, youre allowed to start up the vehicle, go in and inspect, but not allowed to remove from their little lot. so i cant go out and test ride it. i guess perks of living in a smaller town

You will be liable for all reg. fees unless you get lucky. Check the license plate to see if it is current to avoid these. No need to worry about parking tickets, etc. the only other fees that will be assessed are those related to getting the title.

I believe you have to have a dealer/importer/exporter/wholesaler license to title the bike (or know someone who does). Otherwise, it will come back as a salvage title. ***this was the case @ my old job but may not be for the general public***

Also, check to make sure there is a visible engine number, DMV will not process the paperwork without that.

 

[SFSV650]

Dumb question: if one (not me, I have neither time, interest, nor room) wanted to buy something as a parts bike, would this be a much simpler process?

 

[BlueScholar]

Yes.

If you aren't going to register it or ride it on the street, you don't have to worry about the title. Just pay them what they ask, shove the paperwork in your pocket, tow that sucker home and disassemble at your leisure.

Of course, should there be a legal investigation in to the bike (highly, highly improbable), you would be able to show vague ownership at best.

If you want to have a parts only title in your hand, you will have to complete all the same paperwork as any other lien purchaser

 

[corndog67]

I bought a liened 91 Ford truck and a 85 Honda Nighthawk 700s. Both from tow companies. $800 for the truck , $300 for the Nighthawk. No issues at all with registering either, both had been cleared by the tow companies.

 

[Ogier le Danois]

Too much hassle and risk for the reward.

 

[BlueScholar]

Too much hassle and risk for the reward.

For the most part, I would agree if you are the average buyer.

If you, or you know someone who does, have experience with liens and are competent at reading paperwork and it all checks out, there is no reason why it would be any harder to get the title than if it were a clean/salvage title.

As for the quality of the bike, if it starts, runs and looks straight, I don't see how it is any more risky than buying it from Joe Blow on Craigslist. Plus, you get to pay less for this perceived risk.


BUT, when things go wrong with liens, they get messy fast and it is usually the new owner left to sort things out. This is why I say make double sure that the paperwork is good and you will be just fine.

 

[Jacare]

So the idea of purchasing one of these vehicles, car or motorcycle, would be much better suited for use as a track bike rather than a street bike? I've always wanted to have a cheap bike to run around with, and my local track is pretty close to where I could trailer her.

 

[corndog67]

Too much hassle and risk for the reward.

That's OK. The illegal aliens and I will buy them.

From what I've seen, the tow truck companies have to get the registration in their name before they can sell it. I never had an issue with registering them. I rode that Nighthawk S I bought for a couple years, and same with the Ford truck I bought, sold both of them for a profit a couple years later.

I haven't been bit yet.

 

[BlueScholar]

So the idea of purchasing one of these vehicles, car or motorcycle, would be much better suited for use as a track bike rather than a street bike? I've always wanted to have a cheap bike to run around with, and my local track is pretty close to where I could trailer her.

Having never been to a track (yea, yea...), I assume they make no attempt at checking ownership of the vehicles driven there? If this is the case, yes, you could save yourself the DMV trip if you just want a track/non street legal bike..

Edit: You also risk a decent possibility that you run in to a POed previous owner who has a vendetta for the tow shop and lien process that took his/her bike

 

[NoTraffic]

So the idea of purchasing one of these vehicles, car or motorcycle, would be much better suited for use as a track bike rather than a street bike? I've always wanted to have a cheap bike to run around with, and my local track is pretty close to where I could trailer her.

Anything at the track just goes through Safety inspection, they do not verify registration or ownership. Which makes sense because you do not need to register your bike for private road courses.

On the other hand, if you ever want to ride your bike on public domain - you better be sure that bike is registered and titled.