Say NO to repetitive ABS threads - let's talk about how to brake better

[ilikefood]

Regardless of opinions about ABS, I think we would all agree that braking well is an important skill. I figured it might be good to talk about specific things that riders can do to improve their braking skills. A "tips and trick" thread that's hopefully constructive and helpful (unlike pro-ABS and anti-ABS arguments).

So, what do you do to improve your braking skills? What works and what doesn't?

As for me, I practice hard braking whenever I can. Typically if I have to stop for a light or stop sign, and there isn't anyone behind me. I hope this will help develop good reflexes and an intuitive feel for hard braking that will be useful in emergency braking situations.

One thing that I find very helpful when braking hard (at least in a straight line) is keeping pressure off the bars. I lock onto the bike with my knees and feet and support the weight of my upper body with my lower back muscles. This way I put no extra pressure on the bars even under hard braking, maintaining a very light touch. This gives me a much better feel for what the front tire is doing. And - this is key - helps keep the bike upright if the front tire does slide. When you put all your weight on the bars and the front starts skidding, it's very easy to accidentally turn the bars and go down. When you maintain a super light touch on the bars, this won't happen - the tire skids but continues tracking straight, so you have time to release the brakes. I've skidded the front for a good 10-20 ft in the wet with no bad effects.

I also try to practice braking over patches of slippery surfaces (like white lines and manhole covers), to get a feel for what happens in low-traction situations.

 

[oaklandish]

I like to ride a bicycle dirt trail and play with stopping distance. I first started riding in the dirt and feel that dirt experience is invaluable.

I like the discussions on ABS. I just don't understand why people argue the necessity of it rather than if it can provide assistance.

 

[UDRider]

Don't go stabby, stabby on the brakes. Progressive smooth application to allow front tire to squish.

Parking lots are great for practicing braking. For practicing e-braking, as soon as you stop move either left or right.

 

[ratsblast]

I think a lot of braking is psychological. Under duress the natural inclination is to overapply the brakes especially lock up the rear if you arent comfortable using the fronts. I find stopping faster involves applying the brakes slower. You want to apply the brakes progressively so you build on the traction of the tires. The faster the brakes are applied the less time for the compliance to leave the suspension, the front end dives and the rear end gets wiggly. It is easy to overcome the traction limits of the tires if you misapply the brakes.

 

[guineapig]

To OP, If you've never had a bike with ABS then you shouldn't be making an Anti-ABS click-bait title. Why don't you just say that seat belts are for losers and same with airbags? Lets just face facts, you don't have the skill to out-brake ABS and you are just fooling yourself to convince others that a safety mechanism like ABS is not necessary. Say no to stupid click-bait titles and ignorant posers.

 

[afm199]

This is a very good discussion, and one that has a place on BARF. Technique is the most important riding skill that you can develop. Without it, you're hoping that fate and mechanical aids will keep you alive. The most important thing any rider can do is develop their technique as much as possible. In this instance ABS is a great tool, and it's only a tool. Without good braking technique you will never reach your pinnacle of performance.


Never stab, never jam, never cram on the brakes. Initiate braking with a pull that brings the pads into contact with the rotor and dips the front a bit. That squishes the front tire and increases contact patch, which increases traction. As soon as traction increases, and in this instance were talking fractions of a second, then you can quickly build pressure on the brakes, as the situation dictates.

If done this way you guarantee the highest traction you can get and it's unlikely you're going to slide the front. It's more likely the rear will come up.

 

[clutchslip]

Regardless of opinions about ABS, I think we would all agree that braking well is an important skill. I figured it might be good to talk about specific things that riders can do to improve their braking skills. A "tips and trick" thread that's hopefully constructive and helpful (unlike pro-ABS and anti-ABS arguments).......

One thing that I find very helpful when braking hard (at least in a straight line) is keeping pressure off the bars. I lock onto the bike with my knees and feet and support the weight of my upper body with my lower back muscles. ....

Good idea, but you are going to get post like guineapig's post, anyway. :laughing

There is some talk about skill in the ABS threads. But already you brought up a debatable point of view. MotoGP, and on down, racers don't grab the tank with their knees to brake. And their braking forces far exceed what virtually anyone will experience on the street. So now what?

Sometimes it takes guts to brake properly, because your closing rate will be very fast when first gradually squeezing the brake. Trusting your hand and bike to make a stop in time, not only takes practice, but a mental toughness to stay calm. I have come inches from cars before stopping. But I didn't hit anything and didn't go down.

To OP, If you've never had a bike with ABS then you shouldn't be making an Anti-ABS click-bait title. Why don't you just say that seat belts are for losers and same with airbags? Lets just face facts, you don't have the skill to out-brake ABS and you are just fooling yourself to convince others that a safety mechanism like ABS is not necessary. Say no to stupid click-bait titles and ignorant posers.

 

[Enchanter]

To OP, If you've never had a bike with ABS then you shouldn't be making an Anti-ABS click-bait title. Why don't you just say that seat belts are for losers and same with airbags? Lets just face facts, you don't have the skill to out-brake ABS and you are just fooling yourself to convince others that a safety mechanism like ABS is not necessary. Say no to stupid click-bait titles and ignorant posers.

That's not how I read the post. Let's take a moment or three to relax and see where this thread goes.

 

[redtail]

I believe that practice is essential, on each bike you ride and not assuming that they're going to brake the same. Knowing how the front is going to bite, pressure required, all the while focusing on the road. Multiple practice sessions help to ingrain the habit of braking progressively, not the "oh shit, grab a handful" technique.

Any intelligent conversation about perfecting ones skill set, needs to include all options that will accomplish that goal. And in braking, the goal is having the ability to keep stopping distance at a minimum. I personally accept any technology that will successfully assist me in that goal.

Notice I didn't mention ABS?

 

[Tydive]

Keep your eyes up. A high visual horizon and wide vision make for smoother stopping. Looking down increases your sense of speed and tends to make people react in a rushed or jerky fashion.

 

[Z3n]

How do I practice braking? I bought a bike with a very good, sport oriented ABS system and regularly take it to the limit of available traction. You learn when you experience that edge between full braking and lockup, and the easiest, safest way to experience that is with a bike that doesn't allow a lockup to persist to the point of causing a crash.

Beyond that, go ride dirt, which is a completely different set of conditions on a completely different type of bike with a completely different type of body position, different set of effective braking balances, as a distant second to just being able to learn about the limits of traction on your street bike.

long ago I advocated that you learn to brake by working up to experiencing lockup and managing that. Some folks thought that was absurd. Now you can do that with effectively zero risk thanks to ABS. It's the best way to learn to brake effectively, anything else is hoping and praying you react to a high risk lockup the right way in a split second, as you're attempting to learn the skills to manage that lockup at the same time.

 

[bikeama]

That's not how I read the post. Let's take a moment or three to relax and see where this thread goes.

+1 one this could be a very good thread. Everyone need to practice braking. If you are helping a new rider you need to go over braking with them



Everyone has see this video. This frame shows a new rider about to grab all the front brake he can. We all know what happens next. Sometimes it is better to ride through and not panic (brake).

 

[KazMan]

But not everyone can just go out and buy a modern bike with ABS. Some choose to ride older model bikes, classics, or vintage bikes.

I have an '15 R3, '14 FZ-09, '13 R6, '86 YZ250, '74 RD350. All have front disc brakes, none have ABS, so this thread is relevant to me as I perhaps share my experiences, or more importantly, learn more skills.

Braking with or without ABS is a skill that can...no...should be developed by every rider. And like most things, you don't start off as expert status. You learn basic fundamentals that provide a foundation for you to build off of.

Trail braking would be a prime example. We can all talk about it, but there's a percentage of us who cannot take full advantage of this skill.

And the video above is a perfect example of having braking skills, whether or not you have ABS.

 

[rsrider]

Never stab, never jam, never cram on the brakes. Initiate braking with a pull that brings the pads into contact with the rotor and dips the front a bit. That squishes the front tire and increases contact patch, which increases traction. As soon as traction increases, and in this instance were talking fractions of a second, then you can quickly build pressure on the brakes, as the situation dictates.

If done this way you guarantee the highest traction you can get and it's unlikely you're going to slide the front. It's more likely the rear will come up.

This. The thing is you have to be able to get your braking done quickly. So learning to apply the brakes properly is what you should be focused on. Then it will become muscle memory and when you do need to panic stop, the braking will be automatic and you can go to the next phase which is looking for an out. Never give up on the braking.

I have 4 bikes and each of them brakes differently. And because 3 NEED the rear brake applied to stop efficiently, I use the rear brake on all of them. The scooter's main brake is the rear brake. If I tried to use the front for the majority of braking, like you should on a motorcycle, I would never get the thing stopped.

Road, tire, and brake conditions will factor significantly in your braking, so that's another thing to keep in mind. Service your vehicle properly. Find a tire that gives you the best front end feel and keep it properly inflated. And when you replace your brake pads, go for a higher grade compound then the OEM. The wear parts on your bike from the factory are pretty generic and low end to keep the cost down. Keep your brake fluid clean and your cables lubed. It doesn't matter how well you can brake if the mechanics on your bike are shite.

 

[clutchslip]

Everyone has see this video. This frame shows a new rider about to grab all the front brake he can. We all know what happens next. Sometimes it is better to ride through and not panic (brake).

I don't think this is a good example of the subject. It is the first time that I have seen it and the way they were riding, I thought it must be a one way road. This was about other poor riding choices before swerving instead of braking. Scared me, good, btw.

 

[WWWobble]

That's not how I read the post. Let's take a moment or three to relax and see where this thread goes.

+2. This time I find agreement with Enchanter

... The most important thing any rider can do is develop their technique as much as possible. In this instance ABS is a great tool, and it's only a tool. Without good braking technique you will never reach your pinnacle of performance.

I totally agree with above. Developing braking skill is an important goal ABS / non ABS, whatever it is you're riding.

However, I also believe that heavy braking, "emergency" braking is really a LAST CHANCE option. 100% of my riding time I do my best to scan traffic, road conditions, etc with a Plan B that would avoid brakes, i.e. quickly change bike position, maybe accelerate out of trouble, anything that avoids extreme use of brakes.

But, in those cases where there is no throttle or position option, then hell yeah, good braking knowledge and discipline is what you want.

WWWobble

 

[jh2586]

Don't grab the brakes. It's supposed to be a steady increasing pressure. I think it's a lot harder to put this in effect than it sounds.

 

[dravnx]

Back to the OP. Can anyone recommend some braking excercises to increase/develope braking skills? Are these excercises universal or would they be specific to a particular type of bike. Cruiser, sport, tour, adv, ABS, non-ABS?

 

[afm199]

Back to the OP. Can anyone recommend some braking excercises to increase/develope braking skills? Are these excercises universal or would they be specific to a particular type of bike. Cruiser, sport, tour, adv, ABS, non-ABS?

If you can find a friend, practice in a parking lot. Do drive bys at 25 mph and have the friend drop, or not drop a flag or marker as you approach. It's an opportunity to react to stimulus without much danger.

Do practice stops on a static marker you approach at 25-30 mph. You don't have to do panic stops, but do rapid stops. Over and over and over. You're developing muscle memory. It's more important to understand initial and progressive braking than to have fast reflexes.

 

[ilikefood]

To OP, If you've never had a bike with ABS then you shouldn't be making an Anti-ABS click-bait title. Why don't you just say that seat belts are for losers and same with airbags? Lets just face facts, you don't have the skill to out-brake ABS and you are just fooling yourself to convince others that a safety mechanism like ABS is not necessary. Say no to stupid click-bait titles and ignorant posers.

I don't see where you're getting an anti-ABS message from what I posted. I got tired of seeing pointless, never-ending discussions about ABS that rehash the same arguments over and over again and don't help anyone with their riding. I figure that shifting to a discussion about how to brake better (regardless of whether your bike has ABS or not) would be more constructive and could actually help people improve their skills.