New safety protection idea - break away boot soles

[Schnellbandit]

Agree with some of that.

Panic though, is the result of a lack of training, lack of skill and or knowledge. In a panic, some people will drive or ride off the road and into a tree to avoid running over a squirrel, others will just drive over and look back to see the result.

The anaolgy to ski bindings is a reach, they weren't designed to breakway because the skier panics. Skiers aren't trying to hold up themselves and several hundred pound of machine on asphalt. The bindings let the boot sep from the ski and get away from the ski, not remain attached and try to save the ski.

 

[canyonrat]

Yes, the foot down is a reflex- like reaction. The videos I've seen show a forceful step down in an attempt to push the bike upright. I did it once on dirt with a dirt bike. Terrible pain from what is called a "high ankle sprain". It doesn't even involve the ankle...LOL

 

[canyonrat]

Also about training. I am a well trained canyon rider, practiced and experienced with oh sh!t moments. I still can not eliminate a .05 second flinch reaction of covering the brake and squeezing and releasing. I've always released and ride through such situations, but I would love to eliminate that quick little squeeze.

 

[HeatXfer]

Here's the answer...

 

[revnort]

Slippery yes, break away no. I'd rather not have the structural integrity of my boot compromised for the remainder of the crash.

 

[CDONA]

I did this back in '06.
Riding my '03 Vrod on my way to a tractor meet on 89 north of Flagstaff in July. ADOT uses volcanic cinders instead of sand/salt for winter that is just the shade of dark grey as the asphalt.
I entered the center turn lane for a left, running about 55, applying the front brake with moderate effort. I was distracted by somebody parked along the right side of the hwy.
Front wheel tucked to the right in the cinders, I went full dirt auto and released the brake, and did the high speed dab with my right leg before I got my head turned back to forward.
When my leg passed thru front to behind me, it jacked me off the seat, I'm surprised I didn't kick my self in the head. No biff.
I did turn into the meet and stop, my knee was damaged, I tried to walk but it felt numb and foldy with great pain.
I rode back thru town and put my bike back into the garage part of the toy hauler while I still could walk.
I believe I tore some tendon in my knee, I could see something loose under the skin above the kneecap. I didn't go to the hospital, I thought I could tough it out, I did. I called in from work for a week and hobbled about with a cane for about two months

Riding dirt for years saved me & bike from road rash, auto reflexes, never gave it conscious thought as it happened until I recovered control.

 

[moto-rama]

Replaceable legs

Removable/Replaceable ankles. That's the ticket.

 

[moto-rama]

Replaceable legs

Removable/Replaceable ankles. That's the ticket.


I will admit to "feeling" the road surface when I suspect that it's got gravel or other traction reducing condition.
I drag my foot for a second, though, not putting any weight on it.

 

[Snaggy]

The only complete PCL tear I've ever seen was a rider who touched his foot down behind the foot peg. The PCL gave it up before he sustained a midshaft tib/fib fracture though he had soft tissue damage where the peg dug into the anterior lower leg. That kinda highlights the problem. The sole of the foot is a fulcrum and the forces transferred up can be immense. At the same time, riders need a stable platform on the footpeg or even coming down stairsteps when walking off the bike.

I'd think you'd have major design problems trying to come up with a device that detached at a load that worked under a broad set of conditions. Most riders would spend a lifetime without ever needing the product as opposed to skiers who biff a lot more often.

I think it would be more of a racer's injury but they also put a lot of force on the inside peg and need a solid hookup with the bike.

 

[tzrider]

Slippery yes, break away no. I'd rather not have the structural integrity of my boot compromised for the remainder of the crash.

+1

The earlier post of sliders on the boot sole seem to be a step in the right direction.

A long time ago I experiences a highside in which one of my boot soles was torn off the boot on impact. That foot was broken. I'll never know if it would have been anyway, but the boot sole was part of the structure of the boot and the boot was way too flexible without it to offer any protection.

Another consideration: Make the boot sole as low profile as possible. IMO a tall heel or excessively think sole is a recipe for ankle injuries as the sole thickness adds extra leverage against the joint. I've been an ice climber for about 25 years. A 5' fall is sometimes enough to cause a grievous tib/fib spiral fracture, as the crampon points catch, don't slide and add about an inch and a half of extra leverage against the leg.

I prefer a boot with a low profile sole that is the widest part of the boot (for stability).

 

[Onebadscot]

First I would never attempt to put my foot down at high speed!
But as pointed out already this is common in SM.
I had a friend SM610 I think was his Barf name.
He would put cutting board plastic on his boots.
I had the Sidi's already shown.
Now my experience.
100x's of saves learning to backin.
I saved a lowside on my street fighter by sliding my foot as a third wheel.
It works if you don't "stomp"
This view is only based on my SM and ONE street save!
Which was one too many :ape

 

[Aj510]

I watched the video mentioned and the type of situation in which the foot got "de-gloved" we're extremely high speeds by professional riders. If my memory serves me the most examples of this came from the isle of man tt, so you guys referring to a supermoto or being an experienced canyon rider...... You show me the canyon or supermoto able to achieve 150+ mph. I think in this whole forum there is only 1 person able to leverage personal experience and anyone who says that putting the foot down is a lack of skill or training let's see you qualify for the isle of man.

From the replys it would appear most of you did not see the video mentioned and are commenting on a situation that you didn't really have a grasp on.

 

[OldMadBrit]

For years I suffered from the "dab" reflex, when riding my >550lb Capanord off road. I knew it was dangerous. So I did the American Supercamp when they passed through Calistoga and made a conscious decision to never put my feet down. I found I could slide the bike around just fine without ever touching down.

On the last ride of the second day of my class, I decided I was "cured" so put my left foot down to "save" a crash I wasn't having - and broke my ankle. Lesson learned!!

I have now done the Calistoga camp for the last 3 years and seem to be cured of the foot dab reflex. Every time the dab reflex fires, the pain reflex stops it dead in its tracks LOL.

 

[aminalmutha]

are you drunk?

LoLz. Maybe high.

 

[canyonrat]

Wow, I thought I was alone in my thinking about "foot down to save from crashing." Its good to see the thinking here. I like the idea of cutting board on the sole of the boot.

 

[Map8]

Wow, I thought I was alone in my thinking about "foot down to save from crashing." Its good to see the thinking here. I like the idea of cutting board on the sole of the boot.

The cutting board material wears super fast and its like walking on ice. I think I've seen more potential for injury watching people who use this approach fall or nearly fall walking around the paddock. One budget approach is to use a caulking gun and a tube of silicone. Better to walk on than the cutting board material and wears longer. Disclaimer: I DO NOT recommend either product for street riding and make no endorsement of this product for any application relating to motorcycling or any other use not intended by the manufacturer.

 

[ZagiFlyer]

. . . Then an idea pops into my pee brain . . .

Did you perhaps mean pea-brain? Just curious.