Getting COVID doesn’t create immunity but a manufactured vaccine does?

[DrSwade]

Can someone explain this please?
Because all along I have understood vaccines to be either actual viruses which weren’t living or a lab grown version of these diseases that weren’t viable which when introduced into the human body, would create an immune response, thereby preventing the host from getting the actual disease or at the least, a lesser serious case of said disease.

Is there another pathogen out there which we have been innoculated against in which getting and surviving the disease doesn’t create a form of immunity?

 

[bojangle]

Can someone explain this please?
Because all along I have understood vaccines to be either actual viruses which weren’t living or a lab grown version of these diseases that weren’t viable which when introduced into the human body, would create an immune response, thereby preventing the host from getting the actual disease or at the least, a lesser serious case of said disease.

Is there another pathogen out there which we have been innoculated against in which getting and surviving the disease doesn’t create a form of immunity?

Says who?

Having covid does create immunity.

What am I missing?

 

[ScottRNelson]

From what I've read, there are a handful of cases where people have gotten Covid twice, but it's rare. The disease hasn't been around long enough to know how long immunity lasts, regardless of whether it's from getting the disease once or from a vaccine.

I've found the best articles on the subject at https://arstechnica.com/
Search for "Covid" and you'll get a bunch of well written and informative articles.

 

[CDONA]

Or,
Is it you can still catch the 'rona after the complete vaccination, with the current disclaimer "you can still catch the 'rona, but it won't kill you".

This bugs me, you still can get sick.

 

[cheez]

Immunity from having caught and had COVID comes from your body having recognized an invading protein or other mass, manufactured enzymes to target it, and has the memory of both that invading protein and the enzymes that were effective at targeting it to use to keep you from "catching" the thing again. In many cases, your body is defeating COVID not by targeting the best protein for identifying and preventing the transmission of COVID, as the vaccine is targeted for, but is targeting some other protein assembly in the virus, which is harder to detect, takes longer to respond to, etc. It may be a slight variant of the virus which doesn't have whatever factor your body chose to identify and target in it, or present in the same form, etc.

The vaccine (Moderna/Pfizer specifically) is developed to target the specific protein the COVID virus uses to invade cells. It's always present in COVID and if it disappears, it's likely the virus has become less transmissible, so the vaccine being less effective isn't automatically bad. By using this specific protein, the body develops the blueprints to attack this protein and files them away once the infection is fought- providing a much more targeted and effective immunity than the general, un-directed response of your immune system.

The J&J vaccine is the 'dead virus' variant- unlike the Moderna/Pfizer vaccines.

 

[Yakoo752]

I think the term you are looking for is sterilizing immunity and not all vaccines provide this. It appears this may create an effective immunity.

Just because you develop an immune response doesn't guarantee you won't get it in the future.

You can get covid twice and it appears you can get covid after you get the vaccination, the rates seems quite similar.

 

[Jammer]

My wife's nephew caught covid twice, 8 months apart. He recovered fully each time, not surprising since he's 24 and very healthy.

 

[tgrrdr]

Having covid does create immunity.

it may not create lasting immunity in all cases. My understanding is that reinfection rates are low but there have been documented cases.

Even the vaccines may require periodic boosters. This is not uncommon.

 

[tgrrdr]

possibly of interest.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(20)30764-7/fulltext

 

[splat]

Is there another pathogen out there which we have been innoculated against in which getting and surviving the disease doesn’t create a form of immunity?

I'm not a virologist, but the answer is yes.

You can get innoculated against shingles and it has a 90% efficacy. Or you can get shingles multiple times (more than twice is rare though).

Tetanus, you don't get immunity from being infected.

Haemophilus influenzae type B(HiB) also doesn't give you immunity if you've had it before.

Same goes for Pertussis/whooping cough, Pneumococcal Disease/strep, rotavirus, and I'm sure plenty of others.

 

[Climber]

I think it will be unique if the vaccine gives you better immunity than having actually had the disease in the past.

It doesn't seem clear to me why we'd want to vaccinate people who have already had it unless it is to boost their immunity, but I'd think that they should be getting a vaccine at a later date as it seems wasteful and inefficient to vaccinate somebody who already had it in front of people who hadn't.

 

[bojangle]

I think it will be unique if the vaccine gives you better immunity than having actually had the disease in the past.

It doesn't seem clear to me why we'd want to vaccinate people who have already had it unless it is to boost their immunity, but I'd think that they should be getting a vaccine at a later date as it seems wasteful and inefficient to vaccinate somebody who already had it in front of people who hadn't.

Depends. Would you deny the vaccine to a healthcare worker who works with covid patients and had already contracted the virus?

 

[Climber]

Depends. Would you deny the vaccine to a healthcare worker who works with covid patients and had already contracted the virus?

The question is, would it do them any good?

If they already had it and were getting exposed once in awhile, wouldn't that lead to a natural reinforcement of their immunity?

 

[berth]

The question is, would it do them any good?

Actually the question is would it do any harm.

 

[bojangle]

The question is, would it do them any good?

If they already had it and were getting exposed once in awhile, wouldn't that lead to a natural reinforcement of their immunity?

It wouldn't do any harm. Might give stronger immunity like a booster. Would you bet your life on continued high risk work without a vaccine when some form of protection is available?

I've had it. I have daily contact with the public in fairly high risk circumstances. I'm planning on getting the vaccine and don't feel I should have to wait behind lower risk people simply because I've already had it.

 

[Climber]

It wouldn't do any harm. Might give stronger immunity like a booster. Would you bet your life on continued high risk work without a vaccine when some form of protection is available?

I've had it. I have daily contact with the public in fairly high risk circumstances. I'm planning on getting the vaccine and don't feel I should have to wait behind lower risk people simply because I've already had it.

I have no problem with you and others at the highest risk getting it...as long as there is a benefit to it, that it increases you resistance.

We don't really know that, do we? I know there has been some serious talk about only giving 1 dose of the pfizer vaccine to spread it out among more people. It seems like it's coming down to a numbers game.

 

[ctwo]

The only harm I think it could do is deprive some other vulnerable person that hasn't been infected, because supply is limited right now.

It doesn't have to be some random 95 year old father, it could be another FL worker, or a teacher that ends up in class being exposed and exposing many kids and their families.

 

[SantaCruzRider]

My layman's understanding, and having had CV, is that contracting Covid isn't necessarily a standardized event and some folks encounter it with a much higher viral load than others and their immune responses are different. Potentially that means someone could show symptoms, get sick and test positive, but not necessarily develop a strong immunity.

My personal belief is that you are likely still to have the needed immunity to not necessarily keep you from getting sick, but to keep you out of the hospital and from dying.

I'm in no big hurry, but will still get the vaccine when it's available (personal position). BTW: having COVID sucked, I felt like I was sipping air through a straw, and aches and pains were bizarre -- I pity folks who have existing issues or conditions. You don't want this.

Stay health my friends...

 

[Starpower]

No immunity from the vaccine, just a MUCH lower reaction to the infection. In fact not one person has been hospitalized or died from Covid since being vaccinated. This is an astonishing accomplishment! In addition 150m people are expected to be vaccinated by the end of March. There is a lot of hope and good news here. I just got my 1st round, never been so excited to be stabbed by a needle!

 

[Agent Orange]

If theres no immunity and we can still catch it, will it ever be safe enough to resume our normal activities? I got my first shot yesterday as well.