Friendly backroad cornerning advice

[MotorcycleMan]

Ive been riding for a few years, 99% on backroads (other 1% getting to the "good roads") and there are a few things I have picked up I'd like to share.
If you have anything helpful to add feel free to comment and hopefully we can help some people out.

Always be aware. Know what your line should look like. Where your apex should be. Not for speed; you should be thinking to yourself where is the safest place for you to be at your apex. Is oncoming traffic visible? Does oncoming traffic have a blind turn? You don't want to hug that yellow line too much, you never know when a car will stray even a few feet into our lane.

Ride within your own personal limit and always leave some room for error as we never know what is around the corner. Crashed cars, deer running across the road, a massive buffalo, a driver making a U-turn in the middle of a blind turn, the list is endless.

Ride safe my friends and always wear your gear.

 

[motomania2007]

All good suggestions!

 

[Maddevill]

Always keep your eyes up. The farther you look ahead the more time you have to adapt changing conditions. Keep your upper body relaxed and loose. Riding stiff will make the bike run wide in turns. TRUST THE BIKE. Modern bikes can corner very, very well. If you feel you're too fast into a corner, stay loose and try the corner anyway. In the vast majority of cases the bike will make it, IF you let it.

Mad

 

[JohnEPA]

And don't come flying through downtown Boulder Creek at 50 mph! No-one is impressed.

 

[Maddevill]

And don't come flying through downtown Boulder Creek at 50 mph! No-one is impressed.

But when I do 50 up in the hills there's no one to SEE me!!!:teeth

Mad

 

[Hawaiirider]

If you see ONE deer, there's likely some more around that next corner.

 

[budman]

Nice post.

To add: expect bicycles. Always.
Expect cars in the other lane to give them way more room that the law dictates in the most silly places.

:ride

 

[solarae]

If you come up behind a car going slow and there is anything to the left for them to turn into they will.

 

[day004]

A technique I've developed when riding mountain roads is to always keep my eyes on the inside line in right hand turns, especially blind ones that I've unfamiliar with. Using the concept that the bike goes where your eyes point, if the turn tightens up , my vision will pull my line to match the road. If I were looking at the center line my line would drift out to meet it.
Of course ,I keep my vision moving from corner to corner. Inside,middle.repeat...

 

[GAJ]

Nice post.

To add: expect bicycles. Always.
Expect cars in the other lane to give them way more room that the law dictates in the most silly places.

:ride

Very very important, especially when going downhill as oncoming cars might be partially or fully in your lane passing a slow bicyclist.

I try to ride with the oft quoted idea on BARF of maintaining 2 seconds of clear vision ahead.

That means very slow speeds at times on upcoming right hand turns in dense twisties.

 

[DataDan]

Try the Vanishing Point technique for reading blind turns. The link is to a BARF post I wrote 10 years ago, but it's timeless.

Experienced riders probably don't need it because they're subconsciously picking up the cues. But developing that intuition takes a while. In the meantime, making the VP observations will help you anticipate turns that often catch noobs unaware.

Geoff, did you mean "4 seconds of clear vision"? I wrote about the Four-Second Rule here and here.

 

[GAJ]

Try the Vanishing Point technique for reading blind turns. The link is to a BARF post I wrote 10 years ago, but it's timeless.

Experienced riders probably don't need it because they're subconsciously picking up the cues. But developing that intuition takes a while. In the meantime, making the VP observations will help you anticipate turns that often catch noobs unaware.

Geoff, did you mean "4 seconds of clear vision"? I wrote about the Four-Second Rule here and here.

Oops, 2 seconds minimum for following distance 4 seconds for blind turns.

 

[Gary856]

Many long-time riders execute their moves without conscious thought, but I started riding only 10 years ago at 44 and I approach it more analytically.

I’ve always been very conscious of, and bothered by, the intrinsic asymmetric nature of left and right turns. Some of the factors are NOT present when you practice in a flat parking lot, but very apparent when riding on a tight and steep road like Mt Hamilton.

These are things to be aware of, and watch out for:

• Right turn:
o for the same curve, the right turn is always tighter than left.
o Sightline is better on right turns than left, especially uphill.
o The right hand controls throttle and brake, and tend to dominate steering too. You have to change the angle of your grip on the throttle on tight right vs. left turns.

• Left turn:
o You’re closer to, and easier to fixate on, the edge of the road/cliff. This is where looking thru the turn is especially critical.
o When you brake hard (with the right hand) into a downhill turn, you tend to stiffen your right arm, which can be fighting the left arm and interfering with turning left.

 

[GAJ]

Many long-time riders execute their moves without conscious thought, but I started riding only 10 years ago at 44 and I approach it more analytically.

I’ve always been very conscious of, and bothered by, the intrinsic asymmetric nature of left and right turns. Some of the factors are NOT present when you practice in a flat parking lot, but very apparent when riding on a tight and steep road like Mt Hamilton.

These are things to be aware of, and watch out for:

• Right turn:
o for the same curve, the right turn is always tighter than left.
o Sightline is better on right turns than left, especially uphill.
o The right hand controls throttle and brake, and tend to dominate steering too. You have to change the angle of your grip on the throttle on tight right vs. left turns.

• Left turn:
o You’re closer to, and easier to fixate on, the edge of the road/cliff. This is where looking thru the turn is especially critical.
o When you brake hard (with the right hand) into a downhill turn, you tend to stiffen your right arm, which can be fighting the left arm and interfering with turning left.

I'm always slower on right handers in the twisties because of sightlines plus blowing a right hand turn can put you over the centerline into oncoming traffic.

 

[HadesOmega]

I do what's called pieing the corner. Pretty much the same when your clearing a room you look through the corner and slice a piece of the pie at a time. Until you know it's absolutely clear on the other side don't fully commit.

Also try to ride in the middle of the lane because you can hang into the oncoming lane on left turns and there may be a cyclist on the right turns. But if you pie the corner you can go for the apex when its CLEAR.

 

[Chachi_Monster]

great stuff!

 

[mjj]

Right turns are great IF you can see past the turn. Seems like most twisties are associated with hilly terrain so there's usually a cliff in the way.

My habit in left turns (extension of Late Entry Late Apex) is to hug the outside of the turn until I can get a clear view of the exit. Not so far as to get into the inevitable dirt and gravel out there, but as close as I dare. I can think of twice I've done this to encounter, smack dab in the middle of the turn, a large oncoming vehicle at least 1/2 way into my lane (one was a logging truck, one was a tour bus). Terrifying, and validating.

I shudder every time I see a sporty rider flying thru a left turn leaned over so that his/her helmet is inches from the DY or center line. Makes me think of Tee Ball.

 

[Gary856]

I came across this very enlightening article on quick-steering vs. trail-braking. They’re illustrated as track techniques but very applicable for backroad riding too. I use one or the other technique based on the situation, but before reading this article I didn't realize the two techniques were at odds. The key message is to be adaptable to the needs of each turn.

https://lifeatlean.com/quick-steering-vs-trail-braking/

 

[ZCrow]

Try the Vanishing Point technique for reading blind turns. The link is to a BARF post I wrote 10 years ago, but it's timeless. ...

I personally think this technique should be taught in basic rider courses. Experienced or newbie it's good to know particularly for new roads.:thumbup

 

[motomania2007]

I personally think this technique should be taught in basic rider courses. Experienced or newbie it's good to know particularly for new roads.:thumbup

We teach, what I think is a better version of that: stay outside until you can see the exit of the turn, then turn in and accelerate. This is taught in a couple different parts of the course.