Desktop CNC engravers- mystery machines from china

auntiebling

megalomaniacal troglodyte
Staff member
there is too much info on this stuff on the web for me to even find a toe hold to start digesting it. i'm curious about these things, largely because CNC is really appealing to do the myriad projects my 6 year old keeps dreaming up for me to build him (you think a HoneyDo list is long, try a DaddyDo!)

something in the "3040" range would probably do for now
https://www.amazon.com/Engraver-Machine-Desktop-Engraving-Drilling/dp/B07VXV4MS5

they're available all over from a bunch of vendors. amazon, alibaba, etc etc
https://www.chinacnczone.com/en/new...-cnc-machine-with-usb-interface_l66_p155.html

so have any BARFERS dabbled with these?
 

wilit

Well-known member
I just bought a 3018 Pro and have been playing around with it. I'm running UGS on a Pi 3B+. I paid $160 shipped for the machine off of Ebay and had the Pi laying around from another project. I bought it because a friend is making serving boards and was looking for a way to do engraving. I may use it additionally to mill some carbon fiber drone frames or battlebot frames. I doubt it would work very well milling aluminum, though I've seen vids of people doing it.
 

cheez

Master Of The Darkside
I'm in the market for a GlowForge right now- if there's a quality cheap laser engraving/cutting setup anyone knows of I'm interested.
 

kuksul08

Suh Dude
How about a 3D printer?

I feel like with those cheap cnc engravers you will quickly want to do more with it (thicker materials, aluminum, steel) and start looking at bigger machines.
 

auntiebling

megalomaniacal troglodyte
Staff member
I just bought a 3018 Pro and have been playing around with it. I'm running UGS on a Pi 3B+. I paid $160 shipped for the machine off of Ebay and had the Pi laying around from another project. I bought it because a friend is making serving boards and was looking for a way to do engraving. I may use it additionally to mill some carbon fiber drone frames or battlebot frames. I doubt it would work very well milling aluminum, though I've seen vids of people doing it.
See most of this is greek to me. Link?

I'm in the market for a GlowForge right now- if there's a quality cheap laser engraving/cutting setup anyone knows of I'm interested.

Faaaaaancy.
For the price they're asking for the Pro version you can get pretty close to a commercial machine. Way outta my.league either way
 

wilit

Well-known member
See most of this is greek to me. Link?

Here's the 3018 Pro CNC machine

Here's the Raspberry Pi. It's a tiny computer that runs a version of Linux. You'll need a monitor, keyboard and mouse too.

Here's where you download UGS which is Universal G Code Sender. It's free and works great with the GRBL controller that comes with the CNC machine. This is what turns the machine code into movement.

Watch James Dean Designs youtube channel on the 3018. You can pretty much do everything from opening the box to cutting just by watching his vids.

Watch this how-to video on how to set up the Raspberry Pi and install UGS.

Also, you'll need Easel. This is where you make your designs and it'll convert a picture into G-code. You save your G-code file and open it in UGS. The "print" in UGS.
 
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auntiebling

megalomaniacal troglodyte
Staff member
Here's the 3018 Pro CNC machine

Here's the Raspberry Pi. It's a tiny computer that runs a version of Linux. You'll need a monitor, keyboard and mouse too.

Here's where you download UGS which is Universal G Code Sender. It's free and works great with the GRBL controller that comes with the CNC machine.

Watch James Dean Designs youtube channel on the 3018. You can pretty much do everything from opening the box to cutting just by watching his vids.

Watch this how-to video on how to set up the Raspberry Pi and install UGS.

Kick ass. Thank you!

Instead of a raspberry pi could I use an ancient old laptop that needs to have ubuntu installed anyway because the windows version it had is dead? Would save me the screen and keyboard/mouse costs
 
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wilit

Well-known member
Kick ass. Thank you!

Instead of a raspberry pi could I use an ancient old laptop that needs to have ubuntu installed anyway because the windows version it had is dead? Would save me the screen and keyboard/mouse costs

Maybe. I've got a Dell D630 running Ubuntu 15.? and I couldn't get UGS to work correctly and it's too ancient to update to 20.x. I think UGS needs at least 18.x to work correctly and I could only upgrade to 16.x before the system requirements exceeded my laptop's capabilities. UGS will also run on Windows, but you need at least Win 7. I have another old laptop that runs fine, but it's on Vista and I didn't want to pay the $139 for a Win 10 license for a 14 year old laptop.
 

auntiebling

megalomaniacal troglodyte
Staff member
Maybe. I've got a Dell D630 running Ubuntu 15.? and I couldn't get UGS to work correctly and it's too ancient to update to 20.x. I think UGS needs at least 18.x to work correctly and I could only upgrade to 16.x before the system requirements exceeded my laptop's capabilities. UGS will also run on Windows, but you need at least Win 7. I have another old laptop that runs fine, but it's on Vista and I didn't want to pay the $139 for a Win 10 license for a 14 year old laptop.

I see. Mine is probably also too old then. Probably just pick up the cheapest windows laptop at Costco if i do go this route.

I do want something that can cut aluminum, which i know is something like "every car is a racecar if you enter a race" looks like the engraver you bought is probably not what I am after but there is likely something similar I'll keep looking
 

cheez

Master Of The Darkside
Faaaaaancy.
For the price they're asking for the Pro version you can get pretty close to a commercial machine. Way outta my.league either way

Yeah, the problem is I can't afford the danged expensive thing, so I've been deferring purchase for literally years and doing hand-work with scrollsaw and jigsaw, which is duuuuuumb.

I'm hoping someone has a cheap knockoff version that can yield similar results that I can make do the job. :D
 

wilit

Well-known member
I see. Mine is probably also too old then. Probably just pick up the cheapest windows laptop at Costco if i do go this route.

I do want something that can cut aluminum, which i know is something like "every car is a racecar if you enter a race" looks like the engraver you bought is probably not what I am after but there is likely something similar I'll keep looking

If you're looking at doing aluminum, you're going to have to spend some serious money. You can upgrade the spindle on a 3018 and cut small parts, but it's slow and there's a high likelihood of failure. A few posts up, I put a link to a bigger CNC that I have contemplated selling. It'll do aluminum.

The 3018 is more suited to woods, plastics and composites. My son is a huge Battlebots fan, so we built an Antweight bot (1lb) for competition. This is what I initially bought the larger CNC machine for, but the smaller one will cut stuff like this pretty easy. The body is made of Nylon.
W8BOIaF.jpg


We also got to meet his Battlebots hero at the competition, Ray Billings who owns Tombstone.
zkviz0A.jpg
 

TylerW

Agitator
Watch this how-to video on how to set up the Raspberry Pi and install UGS.

Also, you'll need Easel. This is where you make your designs and it'll convert a picture into G-code. You save your G-code file and open it in UGS. The "print" in UGS.

Hey, that's my video! Like, that's literally me in the video and my old garage shop in SF! :laughing

Okay, so a bit of my knowledge dump on what I've learned about CNC in the past few years. There's a ton of different ways to generate your CAM and GCode. Easel is one of them, it's the most user friendly, but its also the most limited. Pretty much the only thing I use it for is V-Carving, which means that you're using a bit that's tapered so you can generate designs with tight corners.

Another option for CAM is Carbide Create. You don't need to run it through a web interface, it can also generate V-carving toolpaths, and in general it's a little more powerful and versatile.

Most of the time I'm generating GCode in Fusion 360. They recently reshuffled the hobbyist licensing in Fusion and hobbled the CAM portion of it. The worst part about the new licensing is that you can still generate toolpaths, but it will no longer generate rapid movements - which means that when your bit is traveling above your material from one operation to another, it will be moving at your cutting feetrate - which means that your overall machining time per part will be considerably higher.

I'm still sending my GCode through UGS on a a rasPi - it's still a system that works for me. I'm considering moving it over to a cheap fanless PC so that I can run my laser from the same computer - more on that later.

As for materials, you *CAN* machine aluminum on cheap machines, it's really a question of how patient you're willing to be. There's a ton of deflection in these cheaper machines which means that you need to make shallower cuts and lower feed rates. The lower feed rates means that you're putting more heat on your tool and shortening your tool life. But if you want to make a few one-off parts out of .125" or even .25", it is possible. You need direct air to clear the chips and some lube definitely helps. You're not going to be making a top triple anytime soon, but custom mounting plates? Heck yeah!

But in general, you're better off with wood, carbon fiber, G10, acrylic, or HDPE. MDF machines really beautifully and I just made some parts out of HDPE last week.

For deep diving on machining on hobbyist machines, Check out Winston Makes. - he works for Carbide (who makes the Shapeoko machines) but he's got a ridiculous amount of knowledge about toolpaths, machining strategy, feeds & speeds, plenty more.

I'll have more to say about laser cutters in another post.
 

R3DS!X

Whatever that means
I'm in the market for a GlowForge right now- if there's a quality cheap laser engraving/cutting setup anyone knows of I'm interested.

I keep finding myself on the fence on Glowforge but it seems so limited on what you can do with it.
 

cheez

Master Of The Darkside
I keep finding myself on the fence on Glowforge but it seems so limited on what you can do with it.

For me, I need laser cutting of sheet metal for art projects, and the wife wants to use it to etch breaklines on glass for stained glass projects. But yeah, it's a pretty focused device compared to a CNC mill.
 

TylerW

Agitator
Yeah, the problem is I can't afford the danged expensive thing, so I've been deferring purchase for literally years and doing hand-work with scrollsaw and jigsaw, which is duuuuuumb.

I'm hoping someone has a cheap knockoff version that can yield similar results that I can make do the job. :D

Why Glowforge? Are you looking for the ease of use? The size? Glowforge offers a simple, slick interface for shooting lasers at stuff, but its also relatively underpowered, and very expensive.

Mike Warren from Instructables just did a video for Cool Tools talking about the laser he just bought. It's 80w, much bigger, and cheaper than the glowforge. You do need a decent amount of shop space to dedicate to it, and while Glowforge is great for showing videos of people using it in the living room, you really shouldn't - lasercutters are boxes of deadly fumes that need good ventilation and exhaust so you don't kill yourself or others.


youtu.be/7P661CYrgh4
 

cheez

Master Of The Darkside
Why Glowforge? Are you looking for the ease of use? The size? Glowforge offers a simple, slick interface for shooting lasers at stuff, but its also relatively underpowered, and very expensive.

Mike Warren from Instructables just did a video for Cool Tools talking about the laser he just bought. It's 80w, much bigger, and cheaper than the glowforge. You do need a decent amount of shop space to dedicate to it, and while Glowforge is great for showing videos of people using it in the living room, you really shouldn't - lasercutters are boxes of deadly fumes that need good ventilation and exhaust so you don't kill yourself or others.

You are made of awesome wrapped in a crunchy candy coating of fucking smart. That's exactly the kind of pointer I was hoping for- I haven't found many machines similar to the Glowforge that are at any better of a price point, even DIY, so this is useful.

Love the video- great beard man. Somewhere in a box I have all of the Make Magazine issues stashed... :D
 
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TylerW

Agitator
For me, I need laser cutting of sheet metal for art projects, and the wife wants to use it to etch breaklines on glass for stained glass projects. But yeah, it's a pretty focused device compared to a CNC mill.

You're never gonna cut metal with a 30w laser. You can engrave anodized aluminum, but for metal you need more like 300w.
 

TylerW

Agitator
You are made of awesome wrapped in a crunchy candy coating of fucking smart. That's exactly the kind of pointer I was hoping for- I haven't found many machines similar to the Glowforge that are at any better of a price point, even DIY, so this is useful.

Love the video- great beard man. Somewhere in a box I have all of the Make Magazine issues stashed... :D

Unfortunately there's an enormous price rift in lasers. There's the lowly K40 which can be had for $400, but you'll end up dropping another $2-300 before it's actually useful. But then there's not much of anything until you are ready to drop $2500 on the laser Mike Warren reccomended.

The only one I know of in the middle is the Beamo, which came out of a kickstarter project for a little over a grand. I've heard good things but I don't know much about it.

I still just have a K40. Its great, but it also sucks.
 
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