"Too fast for conditions" - Ticket

[Tj Hunter]

Hey All, just got pulled over today for doing 57 in a 65...yes really. It was during morning traffic on HWY 10 (So Cal), I was not doing anything different then I have for the last 4 years of riding out here (I have been riding longer then driving and raced for 4 seasons). The officer said I was too fast for the "grid lock" his words and said I "almost" collided with a vehicle.

1) The ticket has the incorrect HWY stated on the ticket, from research this can be ammended by the officer, so not a total dismissal due to this. Is that correct?

2) The officer told me "if you were a louder bike, people could hear you better" which basically says to me that this officer is advocating for aftermarket exhaust, which as I understand it are illegal in CA. Not sure if this is admissible or not.

3) I was not speeding faster than conditions allowed, traffic was moving, usually flows between 25-35 MPH during "grid-lock" times. There is a general suggestion of 15 mph over what traffic is doing at the time, which nets me ~50 MPH, I get I was "7" over that but the car could have been traveling faster, I usually ride 35-40 MPH and speed up accordingly with traffic, so I do not feel that it was "unsafe" for the conditions.

4) Because I was in "traffic" is it possible that the radar could have doubled the delta of speed between me and cars, causing in accurate radar information?

This is my first speeding ticket in over 10 years...do I just bite the bullet and pay and do traffic class or fight it?

TIA

 

[TheRiddler]

pulled over today for doing 57 in a 65

That's cool and all but this post is kind of useless if you don't tell us what you were cited for.

1. Yes.

2. Doesn't matter unless he cited you for too quiet of an exhaust :laughing And aftermarket exhausts are not necessarily illegal, although "excessively" loud ones are.

3. By your own admission, you're doing 7 faster than what's safe according to standard guidelines. Is there a "safe" speed in the box on your ticket?

4. You think the radar got you at 57 and you were actually doing half of that? Anything is possible, but not everything is likely.

Based on the limited info provided, lets say you were cited for 22350 for doing 57 with a safe speed of 35, you could probably articulate that 50 was a safe speed based on traffic and a reasonable lane-sharing delta, and were only 7 over a safe speed and not 22 over. It'd be worth contesting to get a fine reduction.

 

[MR662]

Relatively easy for officer to articulate unsafe speed for conditions, while the
15 mph delta is a recommendation, so is not splitting at speeds above 30 mph. Though just recommendations and not a hard set law, its still grounds for building a case against you for unsafe speed. As a rider, and a motor officer thats too fast to be splitting in my own opinion, but I wasnt there to see traffic conditions. Anyways, as Riddler mentioned, you could try to appear in court and get a fine reduction. In my county, that speeding ticket could be in excess of $ 300 for that speed difference, but with fine reduction can be as low as $ 200. You'll have to decide if its worth your time or possibly missing work to fight it or request fine reduction. Otherwise own up to it, request traffic school to keep point off record, and pay fine.

 

[rodr]

Since this is a judgement call... determination of what's a safe speed would surely include your skills as a rider (documented racing background, lack of recent accidents, 4 years of riding the same route etc.) and may be worth arguing in court. Just a thought.

 

[thepretender]

You can get the same ticket while following the guidelines let alone exceeding them, the law is essentially useless. Good luck.

 

[Tj Hunter]

That's cool and all but this post is kind of useless if you don't tell us what you were cited for.

1. Yes.

2. Doesn't matter unless he cited you for too quiet of an exhaust :laughing And aftermarket exhausts are not necessarily illegal, although "excessively" loud ones are.

3. By your own admission, you're doing 7 faster than what's safe according to standard guidelines. Is there a "safe" speed in the box on your ticket?

4. You think the radar got you at 57 and you were actually doing half of that? Anything is possible, but not everything is likely.

Based on the limited info provided, lets say you were cited for 22350 for doing 57 with a safe speed of 35, you could probably articulate that 50 was a safe speed based on traffic and a reasonable lane-sharing delta, and were only 7 over a safe speed and not 22 over. It'd be worth contesting to get a fine reduction.

I was cited for a 22350, you are correct. There is no cited speed, the box for "appox speed" was marked at 57 and "PF/Max" was marked 65. No safe speed indication or written on the ticket.

I just know when going toward a radar gun with vehicles around you the radar usually is not accurate when trying to track a vehicle that is smaller than others around it.

Since this is a judgement call... determination of what's a safe speed would surely include your skills as a rider (documented racing background, lack of recent accidents, 4 years of riding the same route etc.) and may be worth arguing in court. Just a thought.

This was my thought at first too, I may try that.

 

[budman]

You can get the same ticket while following the guidelines let alone exceeding them, the law is essentially useless. Good luck.

Of course you can. Up to the officer, however if within the guideline delta you have a good shot at fighting it.

The law is far from useless. Open up the narrow to see the big picture.

 

[bojangle]

I was cited for a 22350, you are correct. There is no cited speed, the box for "appox speed" was marked at 57 and "PF/Max" was marked 65. No safe speed indication or written on the ticket.

I just know when going toward a radar gun with vehicles around you the radar usually is not accurate when trying to track a vehicle that is smaller than others around it.



This was my thought at first too, I may try that.

Did the ticket indicate the officer used radar?

Radar/lidar certified officers are certified in estimating speeds. So if the officer estimated all surrounding traffic at about 35 MPH, and your motorcycle was estimated at 55/57 MPH, whatever, and then confirmed on radar, that might be a difficult argument to make. If it was lidar, you don't have that issue where it might read a nearby larger object. I am not radar/lidar certified, so I could be missing something.

If you wanted to fight it, your best bet is to argue that your speed was under the limit, you have XXX amount of training/experience, and you believe you felt comfortable with that speed and do not feel it was unsafe for conditions. Unsafe for conditions is rather subjective. I would not try to challenge any radar readings the officer might have, as I doubt you'd get far with that.

 

[bojangle]

Also...

https://www.bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=136742

DISCLAIMER: none of this will be used for court purposes. We are here to help, not get your info and screw you. I expect all the LEO's here to adhere to this disclaimer please.

From now on, and we should have addressed this early on, I would like folks who have questions about tickets to provide minimally the following information.

1. section you were cited for
2. city where you were cited
3. your vehicle info (not required, but helps alot)
4. what the OFFICER TOLD YOU
5. what you TOLD THE OFFICER
6. a brief description of the location (ie...lights, what type of intersection, what type of street, etc.....)

When we have this information it greatly helps us understand the circumstances surrounding your ticket and ways we might help you with it.

brash

Sometimes people will post up partial ticket, or a ticket with personal info blocked out.

 

[boney]

I'm not an LEO.

Its my understanding that lane sharing has always been a gray area, where in reality we are allowed to break numerous laws so long as it was done in a safe manner.

He or She says "No, you were not doing it safely."

What you are planning to do is show up in court and question an LEOs judgement. Ultimately, the judge will have to decide who is more right. The officer who wrote you a ticket, or you.

I know where I'll put my money on that bet. Perhaps your time would be better spent pleading guilty and asking for a reduction in fine.

 

[FreeRyde]

Just because you have been doing it for 4 years, doesn't mean it's safe.

:ride

 

[Beanzy]

I say "bite the bullet" and do traffic school to mask the point.

You can ask for postponements but if the cop said you "almost collided with a car," for sure he'll show up in court and the traffic commissioner will find you guilty.