Self Driving Cars and the Future of Motorcycling

NSR500

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korwl

Member
Cars are going to rice themselves? Get ready for every budget coupe to have a $20k turbo kit dropped into it. Soon owning any car is going to be more expensive than getting married. What has science done... :teeth

EDIT: on a more serious note, anything that makes other drivers on the road less retarded is a good thing. That's less I have to worry about as I maneuver my obsolete, dinosaur burning doomcycle through the coming decades.
 
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Smash Allen

Banned
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ll-be-the-best-thing-to-happen-to-motorcycles



Two part discussion:

1. Do you think self driving/autonomous vehicles make roads safer for motorcycles?

2. Is there a future for motorcycles in the world beyond leisure devices?

1. Yes, provided they are fully developed autonomous vehicles

2. There will be countries with lots of two-wheel locomotion for decades to come. In the US? You can't take away my right to move myself where I want with two wheels under me. Maybe my kids won't care.
 

Gary856

Are we having fun yet?
Imagine when motos (and cars) have enough automated safety features that they cannot crash no matter what you do, even if you tried. Anyone, including your grandma, can go out and pin the throttles, go crazy, and the bikes will make sure they don’t crash into anything. Everyone can enjoy the thrill, no skills required, no risks involved. Like riding a roller coaster, except you’re free to ride every where. I think that’ll be great.
 

motomania2007

TC/MSF/CMSP/ Instructor
Based on the rate of change and projected trajectory of growth of autonomous cars, I don't think autonomous cars will necessarily be "better" for motorcyclists because I think there will be very few motorcyclists and here is my reasoning:

1) We are at the beginning of autonomous cars. Think back to 1998 when MOST consumers were just aware of the Internet but were not using the Internet for much of anything other than to play with and the novelty of email. You can consider 1998 as the beginning of the Internet.

2) Kids born in 1998 and later, can't imagine not using the Internet and using a landline and paper mail (and many other "analog world" things) are all just stupid, arcane wastes of time, even slightly odd and somewhat entertaining novelties to them.

Think of how we think of old cars that had to be handcranked to start, telegraph systems and steam train locomotives. How arcane and amusing in an interesting sort of way...

3) Many, if not most, kids born today (I call them the 2015 generation) will probably never learn to drive a car, get a license or even own a car. They will view all those things as arcane time and money wasters and some will consider them a novelty.

When you were 16-18 would you consider not driving a relatively current tech car and instead, choose to rely on a horse or a horse drawn buggy or even an old Model T or similar old car as your main mode of transportation?

4) As a result, only very few of the 2015 generation will actually drive cars and only a small percentage of those will ride motorcycles.

Thus, in 20-25 years there will be very few motorcycles.

You also have to remember that about 75% of motorcycle accidents are caused by the motorcycle rider and not car drivers so even if we eliminated all of the car drivers and therefore all the car driver caused accidents and made no other changes, we would still have about 75% of the current motorcycle accident statistics.

So yes, autonomous cars will result in fewer motorcycle collisions and there will be fewer motorcycle fatalities but the majority of the reason will be due to fewer motorcycles being ridden.

And no, I don't think that is a good result, but I think that is where we are headed.
 
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TTTom

Well-known member
Imagine when motos (and cars) have enough automated safety features that they cannot crash no matter what you do, even if you tried. Anyone, including your grandma, can go out and pin the throttles, go crazy, and the bikes will make sure they don’t crash into anything. Everyone can enjoy the thrill, no skills required, no risks involved. Like riding a roller coaster, except you’re free to ride every where. I think that’ll be great.

Never happen. After 35 years in tech there's one thing I can tell you... as soon as you think you've got something to the point where it's idiot proof, a bigger idiot comes along.
 

korwl

Member
Thus, in 20-25 years there will be very few motorcycles.
I was actually just discussing this with a friend the other day. We live today -- most likely -- simultaneously in the twilight and golden years of the internal-combustion engined motorcycle. A glorious and slightly bittersweet time to be alive as a motorcyclist. I personally think it'll take a little longer than 25 years for alternative energy and self-driving technology to become affordable and widespread, but it's without a doubt on the horizon. Even now, before those technologies, the number of motorcyclists in developed societies has been steadily declining. Kids these days seem more predisposed to look at motorcycling as a risky, superfluous activity.

Just as well, I suppose.
 

clutchslip

Not as fast as I look.
Imagine when motos (and cars) have enough automated safety features that they cannot crash no matter what you do, even if you tried. Anyone, including your grandma, can go out and pin the throttles, go crazy, and the bikes will make sure they don’t crash into anything. Everyone can enjoy the thrill, no skills required, no risks involved. Like riding a roller coaster, except you’re free to ride every where. I think that’ll be great.
There is no thrill, if there is no danger. I have ridden on many rollercoasters and been bored to sleep because they are on rails. No adrenal rush at all, because I ride motorcycles fast, where I can crash and get hurt or die. Big difference. Masturbation is not the same thing as real sex, either, in case you were wondering. :sex
 

budman

General Menace
Staff member
1. Yes, provided they are fully developed autonomous vehicles

2. There will be countries with lots of two-wheel locomotion for decades to come. In the US? You can't take away my right to move myself where I want with two wheels under me. Maybe my kids won't care.

This in my lifetime.


I was actually just discussing this with a friend the other day. We live today -- most likely -- simultaneously in the twilight and golden years of the internal-combustion engined motorcycle. A glorious and slightly bittersweet time to be alive as a motorcyclist. I personally think it'll take a little longer than 25 years for alternative energy and self-driving technology to become affordable and widespread, but it's without a doubt on the horizon. Even now, before those technologies, the number of motorcyclists in developed societies has been steadily declining. Kids these days seem more predisposed to look at motorcycling as a risky, superfluous activity.

Just as well, I suppose.

Long term I agree with this and motomania.
There will be very few crazy cool folks In The future. Oh wait!!! Those hover board mofos at the XXX games might break a bone. :laughing.

Seriously....There will always be extreme humans. It is in our genetics and will take tens of thousands of years to clear that out. Joe public human will try to control that. To them I say :twofinger
 

motomania2007

TC/MSF/CMSP/ Instructor
I was actually just discussing this with a friend the other day. We live today -- most likely -- simultaneously in the twilight and golden years of the internal-combustion engined motorcycle. A glorious and slightly bittersweet time to be alive as a motorcyclist. I personally think it'll take a little longer than 25 years for alternative energy and self-driving technology to become affordable and widespread, but it's without a doubt on the horizon. Even now, before those technologies, the number of motorcyclists in developed societies has been steadily declining. Kids these days seem more predisposed to look at motorcycling as a risky, superfluous activity.

Just as well, I suppose.

My wife and I had this exact discussion a couple of days ago.

It must be in the air.
 

Marcoose

50-50
Based on the rate of change and projected trajectory of growth of autonomous cars, I don't think autonomous cars will necessarily be "better" for motorcyclists because I think there will be very few motorcyclists and here is my reasoning:

1) We are at the beginning of autonomous cars. Think back to 1998 when MOST consumers were just aware of the Internet but were not using the Internet for much of anything other than to play with and the novelty of email. You can consider 1998 as the beginning of the Internet.

2) Kids born in 1998 and later, can't imagine not using the Internet and using a landline and paper mail (and many other "analog world" things) are all just stupid, arcane wastes of time, even slightly odd and somewhat entertaining novelties to them.

Think of how we think of old cars that had to be handcranked to start, telegraph systems and steam train locomotives. How arcane and amusing in an interesting sort of way...

3) Many, if not most, kids born today (I call them the 2015 generation) will probably never learn to drive a car, get a license or even own a car. They will view all those things as arcane time and money wasters and some will consider them a novelty.

When you were 16-18 would you consider not driving a relatively current tech car and instead, choose to rely on a horse or a horse drawn buggy or even an old Model T or similar old car as your main mode of transportation?

4) As a result, only very few of the 2015 generation will actually drive cars and only a small percentage of those will ride motorcycles.

Thus, in 20-25 years there will be very few motorcycles.

You also have to remember that about 75% of motorcycle accidents are caused by the motorcycle rider and not car drivers so even if we eliminated all of the car drivers and therefore all the car driver caused accidents and made no other changes, we would still have about 75% of the current motorcycle accident statistics.

So yes, autonomous cars will result in fewer motorcycle collisions and there will be fewer motorcycle fatalities but the majority of the reason will be due to fewer motorcycles being ridden.

And no, I don't think that is a good result, but I think that is where we are headed.

Don't know. You can also say hunting is archaic as heck, given you can find all the food you need and then some within a few minutes of your house. Yet, there are more hunters than ever, not to mention gunz. There'll be plenty of drivers and plain vanilla driving vehicles in 20-25 years. Tho, in 20-25 years, I'm going to start considering stop driving, and will gladly welcome a self-driving car for mobility.
 

Aware

Well-known member
Autonomous cars are better driven than human-driven cars, according to those developing them. Which makes the roads safer for Motorcyclists. Those of us who already ride won't give up in a hurry. I don't care if the younger generations don't ride, I simply know we will keep riding and enjoy it till we croak. :cool:
 

motomania2007

TC/MSF/CMSP/ Instructor
Autonomous cars are better driven than human-driven cars, according to those developing them. Which makes the roads safer for Motorcyclists. Those of us who already ride won't give up in a hurry. I don't care if the younger generations don't ride, I simply know we will keep riding and enjoy it till we croak. :cool:

If younger generations don't ride the numbers of motorcycles sold will plummet and the price will skyrocket.

In addition to that, I suspect manually driven vehicles will be strictly limited to a limited number of roads for safety sake and efficiency of the autonomous cars...
 

berth

Well-known member
There may well be a drop in motorcycle sales. As a corollary, there may be a rise as well.

While autonomous cars may offer convenience, they don't offer emotion. They are ego free.

Top Minds in the auto industry see the autonomous cars as the destruction of the branded automobile.

Think about how cars are sold, mostly as a mechanism of lifestyle. "Thrill of the road", etc. Cars are bought based on a myriad of factors, not simply safety, not simply gas mileage. Nobody buys a Jeep for gas mileage. Jeeps are sold like Adventure bikes.

So, the theory is that with the autonomous car, much of that will go away. Since we don't own cars anymore, we simply rent time in them, we're less involved with them. We don't care how we look in them, how they perform, what they say about us. Because they don't say anything, most importantly, because they don't say anything about anyone.

But imagine the feeling you had, when you're in your car, and you saw that bike zip by -- splitting lanes. Or watched some bike take off on a road, and vanish behind a corner. The sound of the bike, the dynamics of the bike, the lean in to the turn.

Or the way the rider was dressed. Matching tank top and flip flops. Decked out in back leather. A long beard poking out of a helmet that looks like it's been filled with expanding foam. And most importantly, the independence of the bike. That person isn't trapped in a shiny metal box, a box you don't even have any control over.

Some will certainly favor the security and convenience of an autonomous car, most will.

But many won't. in fact, many who lose what independence they had simply driving their '93 honda Civic, may well be attracted to the independence of a motorcycle, or scooter.

Or, they'll ban them entirely on public roads.
 

louemc

Well-known member
Never happen. After 35 years in tech there's one thing I can tell you... as soon as you think you've got something to the point where it's idiot proof, a bigger idiot comes along.

:thumbup Totally agree...
 
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