600's vs. 750's

inthewoods

Well-known member
I'm old, and so are my bikes. I sat on a new Honda, big mistake. Thing feels like my RD, nice and compact. Are they that much work on the track? Would a 750 be a better choice. This would be stripped of all the street bike stuff. My wife has been asking me what I want for Christmas.
 

jeffday

Active member
I'm old, and so are my bikes. I sat on a new Honda, big mistake. Thing feels like my RD, nice and compact. Are they that much work on the track? Would a 750 be a better choice. This would be stripped of all the street bike stuff. My wife has been asking me what I want for Christmas.

God I miss my RD's. Those were some of the most fun bikes I've ever had, I think the work was part of the fun for me though, I like to tinker.

How much track experience do you have? For me I think the perfect track bike is the Suzuki SV650. They are nimble, don't need a whole lot of work (other than the usual things that all bikes need like proper suspension, well okay the newer 600's and what not have good suspension from the factory but still could use springs for weight adjustments) and the smooth power curve means if you lug the engine a little bit because you didn't downshift properly they aren't going to care because they can pull out of it with the smooth power curve in them VS the peaky inline 4's that need to have their brains revved out.

For me I cant use all the potential of a newer 600 or a 750 so I'm not that worried about owning one. Plus since the SV has its own race class when/if you decide to go racing you are racing other riders and not necessarily other (read also newer if you get an older model) bikes.

I would just like to say in closing that if your wife will buy you a new 600 or 750 off the showroom floor to turn into a track bike She is a keeper.. Does she have a sister? :lol:
 

inthewoods

Well-known member
I sure as hell can't do 1:47's @ Thunderhill which is what the best can achieve on a 600. Hell, my rd roll's along nicely and I'm right near 2:15's even with suspensions issues. I'm just thinking how nice it would be with something plush. I've got way to much off throttle chatter that's quite unnerving. I have quite a few years of track experience under my belt, even if it was 30 some odd years ago. And I've kept kept my wife 37 some odd years and you would not want to meet her sister.
 

OneRedLT4

Well-known member
After racing a sherman tank (AKA, GSXR1100) and doing well, it was quite an adjustment trying to go fast on a 600, but other than shifting a helluva lot more, flogging it around is a lot easier.

That being said, the 750 is basically the same but much more usable power without being crazy powered like the liter bikes. I'm more comfortable near the edge on the 750 and friends say I'm faster on it than my 1000.

Just a little input. Good luck
 
I love my liter bike, but some days I wish I was on a lighter, smaller 600. I have never ridden a 750, so I presume I might like it.
 

Maygoddess

Well-known member
I have a GSX-R 600 and 750...both 2009. I got the 600 first in 2011..was street only..starting doing track days in 2012. Late 2012, impulse buy was the 750..decided that I was going to be doing lots of track so made the 600 my dedicated track bike and it is plenty on the track. I am not an expert or even fast, but comparing them on the street, I am still taming the much torquier 750 beyotch that she is. I can't imagine I would need her extra power on the track. Everyone says I should try 250/300 on the track (Paging Kazman!) and may have more fun with that.

I think 600 is just perfect for me, but I am not a racer or attempting to achieve any records. I may in fact be selling the 750 shortly as I am not doing as much street riding and having more fun on my Bonneville. Looking into something sport touring next for longer trips..but I digress...

You might want to rent a Feel Like A Pro Ninja 250/300 one track day and work your way up from there? The 250 guys will tell you how fun those bikes are on the track!! :thumbup I am going to try it next season myself for a day!
 

afm199

Well-known member
If you like the RD you'll love the SV650. Seriously fun and much cheaper to run than a GSXR.
 
Now you have me thinking. Those 600's eat tires? Next season the plan is a track day every 3-4 weeks.

Torque eats tires more than anything else. Many people never stop to think about it, but that is the reason you (at least on the street) will go through 2 back tires for every front 1. That is your power wheel and the more torque being applied under acceleration, the quicker the wear.
 

OneRedLT4

Well-known member
I have a GSX-R 600 and 750...both 2009. I got the 600 first in 2011..was street only..starting doing track days in 2012. Late 2012, impulse buy was the 750..decided that I was going to be doing lots of track so made the 600 my dedicated track bike and it is plenty on the track. I am not an expert or even fast, but comparing them on the street, I am still taming the much torquier 750 beyotch that she is. I can't imagine I would need her extra power on the track. Everyone says I should try 250/300 on the track (Paging Kazman!) and may have more fun with that.

I think 600 is just perfect for me, but I am not a racer or attempting to achieve any records. I may in fact be selling the 750 shortly as I am not doing as much street riding and having more fun on my Bonneville. Looking into something sport touring next for longer trips..but I digress...

You might want to rent a Feel Like A Pro Ninja 250/300 one track day and work your way up from there? The 250 guys will tell you how fun those bikes are on the track!! :thumbup I am going to try it next season myself for a day!

Although I'm a liter bike guy, I would so love to race a 250 just for the competitiveness! Although, the expense (or lack of) would also be an attraction.
 

TomQ

Well-known member
I've raced one of Zoran's SVs and had both 600s and 750s as trackbikes. I think it depends on what your goals are.

Learning to ride the SV at pace really cleaned up my riding/racecraft. Line selection, keeping up corner speed, steering inputs, even shifting points all had a significant impact on laptimes. I had to do a lot of things right to consistently run around THill at the 2 min mark. In terms of consumables, I'd go through 2 fronts and 4-5 rears a season.

With a 600, I had power to make up for minor mistakes. With a 750, there's even more power (and a lot less shifting) to make up for mistakes. At my pace, I was getting 2-3 days on the rears.

My 2 cents, if you want to work at a trackday get a SV. If you want to relax, get a 750. I wouldn't recommend a 600, it has enough power so that you don't have to work on your riding but not enough power to pass someone at will (think a liter bike doing 2:05s... you have to pick your spots).
 

inthewoods

Well-known member
I find myself short shifting the RD so I can concentrate on corner exit. Coming off both hills @ TH the bike want's to wheelie so I short shift in those places. I should probably rethink my want's and get the RD's suspension sorted and go from there. It's got plenty of go but the suspensions a bit lacking.
 

afm199

Well-known member
I find myself short shifting the RD so I can concentrate on corner exit. Coming off both hills @ TH the bike want's to wheelie so I short shift in those places. I should probably rethink my want's and get the RD's suspension sorted and go from there. It's got plenty of go but the suspensions a bit lacking.

Do yourself a favor and try a well set up SV. You won't believe the difference a modern track bike makes. I raced vintage for years.
 

jeffday

Active member
Don't get me wrong. I have a hard-on for anything RD/RZ related, or any other two stroke street bike for that matter.. There is no better moto porn.

But like AFM said and I was speaking of earlier, The SV compared to the RD350 is effortless to ride on the track, even with the crap stock suspension that comes on them. The SV corner exit is just as important as it is in the RD so you will have to ride them similarly, but to me you just cant beat the way the SV dives into the corner and asks "please sir, can I have some more"
 

KazMan

2012 Fifty is Nifty Tour!
Staff member
I sure as hell can't do 1:47's @ Thunderhill which is what the best can achieve on a 600. Hell, my rd roll's along nicely and I'm right near 2:15's even with suspensions issues. I'm just thinking how nice it would be with something plush. I've got way to much off throttle chatter that's quite unnerving. I have quite a few years of track experience under my belt, even if it was 30 some odd years ago. And I've kept kept my wife 37 some odd years and you would not want to meet her sister.

Would love to help you with that chatter problem...

Back to the question, it really depends on how you think you want to ride this potential new track bike. For me:

250 Pro - I love the 250, lots of fun riding at the upper limit all the time and even more so when there is a group riding together. You can do a season on 1 or 2 sets of tires for the schedule you were thinking. (I personally got 9 track days out of a set and they still looked great, but too many heat cycles)
250 Con - You will get passed in every straight and it requires a good amount of concentration and diligence to keep speed and out of peoples way as you go back around them in corners. Lots of shifting.

600 Pro - Lots of fun and will feed the adrenaline craving. Well sorted, they handle better than an RD albeit heavier. However, can be ridden fairly effectively using only 2 or 3 gears.
600 Con - Can be hard on tires if you are not mindful of air pressure and suspension setup. Will typically lose the drag race with the liter bikes. R6 has a racing seating position.

1000 Pro - Lots of power. Can be ridden at a fairly good pace only using 1 or 2 gears. Seating postions are usually a little more relaxed than their 600 counter parts.
1000 Con - Weight, fuel.

I personally am pretty easy on tires 900+ miles on a set of Pirelli SC2's before replacing them and could have gotten another weekend out of them had the last day been at Sears instead of Thill. I would imagine the same distance on a liter bike as well. But I am pretty light on the throttle and just try to carry corner speed on exit so I don't have to twist the grip quite so hard down the straight.

This year I have logged some miles on my FZ-09 which is completely different than the race bikes, but reminds me of my days on my 81 Seca 550. Very accommodating seating position but can still get some business done when needed.

So how do you want to ride your 2015 season? Like a race pace, spirited track pace, peppy street pace, or just lettin you all know I am here pace?

There's a lot more I could type, but can't at the moment. :teeth
 

inthewoods

Well-known member
Lot's of reply's, thank's everyone. Believe I've made a decision. I'm sticking with what I have. I'll do a bit more refining on chassis and engine. It also needs a fairing of some kind to keep my helmet off my face. If I can loose another 10lbs, which will be a total of almost 30 I'm going to purchase a set of custom leathers. A far cry from a new bike but, I don't think it will push my buttons like something vintage.

My pace is dictated by my fitness. Being an ex racer I like afap. I'll be seeking help on this chatter issue if I can't get it sorted myself. I'm thinking my rear sag is all wrong after having a lightweight friend sit on the bike.
 

KazMan

2012 Fifty is Nifty Tour!
Staff member
Lot's of reply's, thank's everyone. Believe I've made a decision. I'm sticking with what I have. I'll do a bit more refining on chassis and engine. It also needs a fairing of some kind to keep my helmet off my face. If I can loose another 10lbs, which will be a total of almost 30 I'm going to purchase a set of custom leathers. A far cry from a new bike but, I don't think it will push my buttons like something vintage.

My pace is dictated by my fitness. Being an ex racer I like afap. I'll be seeking help on this chatter issue if I can't get it sorted myself. I'm thinking my rear sag is all wrong after having a lightweight friend sit on the bike.

Give the folks at Air Tech a look for bodywork needs - http://www.airtech-streamlining.com/yamaz/TZ2501978-80EFG.htm

They also have RD stuff, but since you have chambers...:teeth
 
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