You guys are having too much fun!! I need to ...

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Will Farnaby

Well-known member
...get in on the action! Take me to school please, mini racers! :ride

It looks like Stockton has a good program going, and is close enough to home to make this feasible. It also looks a whole helluva lot cheaper than getting involved in track days with my primary bike (cb300f). I really like the idea of learning to race on a dedicated small displacement motard-type bike, where I wont cry in public if I low side it. :laughing
What's the most economical way to get my feet in the water?
All the different classes get a little confusing for me, where would I fit in best? I'm 5' 10", 190 lbs.
Would getting an xr100, slapping some slicks on it, and racing "thunder" class be the way to go? Bigger? Smaller?
I'm not much of a wrencher (at all), so something easy to work on, with plenty of parts available is neccessary. I don't have the finances or band width to be messing around with some exotic European 2-stroke that requires a special wrench handcrafted in Milan by virgin widows to change the oil, no matter how wonderful a bike it might be.
My goals are to have fun, learn my way around a race track, get a bit of grease under my nails, and hopefully meet some cool like minded peeps.
Any input is welcome, so throw your two cents in! Thanks a bunch guys!
 
RickM

RickM

Well-known member
XR100, TTR125, crf150f, KLX140 etc with a set of street/road tires on stock rims are the quickest and cheapest way to get going and least amount of on-going maintenance.

If your goal is training for road race, get safer or faster on your bigger bike at big tracks, Consider a kx65 or any of the 85 class bikes. For racing at Stockton the 65 and 85 class is a good size now and growing too. Atwater also has races. These may/will cost more to setup initially with relacing wheels, or buying cast or prebuilt spoke wheels. And with the 2 strokes it's wise to simply start with a freshly rebuilt top end vs trusting PO claims regrading how many hours on the engine. ( top end parts/gaskets cost under $100)

At 5'10" you should be able to fit on either the 65 or 85. If you come out to Stockton you can sit on some bikes are see how you fit. I am 6' and very fat and non-flexible. Riding a 65 has been a ton of fun.

I'd skip the Italian/ other euro or most miniGP bikes. They are fancy and all. But I don't feel they are better for adult riders. Fun riding with others on similar bikes? sure!

If you have more questions ask away.
 
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Will Farnaby

Well-known member
Thanks so much for responding to my post RickM! I really appreciate it.

You stated "If your goal is training for road race, get safer or faster on your bigger bike at big tracks, Consider a kx65 or any of the 85 class bikes." How is competing with these bikes better training than something like an xr100? Because I could very well see myself getting into road racing in the future, and who doesn't want to be safer and faster? Naturally, any kind of riding that could improve my general street skills would be looked upon favorably as well.
Thanks again man!
 
RickM

RickM

Well-known member
I don't know the whys..Just what I noticed :) The minibikes on 12" race tires helped my track riding more than the clubman setup bikes. Riding roadrace style on the 4 strokes with the stock dirt sized tires was difficult. I was losing traction a lot sooner, especially front end. And didn't hep build confidence to ride in road race style. But riding it dirt/ supermoto style was fine.. The have enough traction to lean the bike over to run out of ground clearance and fold the foot pegs.

The mini 2 strokes on the 12" feels closer to a scaled down sportbike also to me. I am poor with explaining my thoughts over words. Best is to come to the track on a busy day and see what's out there.

An example of how I felt it made me safer is, When ever I thought I have entered too hot into a corner, I started hanging off further try to make the corner instead of giving up on it and stand the bike up attempt to brake within available tarmac.
Basically my default second nature response to trouble is to attempt harder to make the corner vs trying to pick up and slow down after I started riding the minibike.

For street riding I think the supermoto style riding helped more initially. But I also started dirt biking at the same time. I noticed I became more relaxed on the bike when I started dirt biking and supermoto on the clubman setup. The goaty, dirty tight roads that I dreaded previously became very enjoyable if that makes any sense.
 
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Will Farnaby

Well-known member
Very interesting! I wonder why you felt compelled to commit to your hot turns on the 65, and not on the other bike? Is it ergonomics? Is it because braking/slowing down a 2 stoke takes it too far out of the power band, and it takes longer to get back up to speed (I might very well be talking out of my ass here, and these might be very foolish questions due to my lack of knowledge)?
And yeah, I will definitely be checking you maniacs out at the track come June! :thumbup
 
Crjunkee

Crjunkee

Well-known member
what ever mini you get make sure it has disc brakes int the front. youl quickly over heat the little drum on a XR100. unless you dont use breaks and ride like a maniac :)
 
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ToraTora

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RickM said:
I don't know the whys..Just what I noticed :) The minibikes on 12" race tires helped my track riding more...
Click to expand...

I've been saying why for years here on teh Barf. But the small penis disease is so loud that it drowns out all voice of reason.

It's also the reason that I've stated in the other thread he should get a 65 rather than an 85. Not saying that what you have said in that thread and this one isn't valid on a different level of thought, but it's not really a better place to start because it's not as conducive to the learning.

Will--you will hear a lot of things here on teh Barf. It's almost impossible to weed wack through the BS you'll hear here. What your objectives are will greatly determine what you should get, and do remember that riding is a process. What you need today may not be what you need tomorrow. You can always get another bike.

Technology: The two stroke has a lot of advantages. They are inexpensive, light, can be worked on with basic tools, and people with modest skill sets. The four stroke has only one advantage--Honda doesn't hate it (fuck Honda and the Cub it rode in on).

Learning: The elusive answer to Rick's question (the one I keep repeating ad nauseum) has everything to do with how animals (remember humans are animals) learn. You have to be able to experiment (some call this play). If you can't experiment you wont learn (well). The smaller bikes mitigate much of the risk involved. By removing the risk you are encouraged to experiment (play). This dramatically increases your rate of learning, and the quality of your learning.

Fear: Remember how Frank Herbert wrote that "fear is the mind-killer?" What he was getting at is you can't do great things if you are stuck down with fear.

An example: take your full size bike out to the street and turn so that you crash it. No? Why not? Because you are afraid. You are afraid that it will cost a lot. You are afraid that it will hurt. You are afraid that you will look stupid. You are totally afraid.

Do this with a mini like a 65cc dirt bike setup for the track. Well when you get on the bike you are already on the ground. If you fall over it's no big thing because you were already there. The bike crashes so well it is highly unlikely that it will even get damaged. There's no fear. None. So what happens?

You play (experiment), and you learn. You learn quickly, and you learn in a quality way that allows you to repurpose your learning (training). You become a better rider faster and better. There's no mythological reason for this--it's all based on scientific research on how animals (humans are animals) learn. The only real issue around here is this message can't get heard over the massive roar of the small penis disease.
 
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Will Farnaby

Well-known member
ToraTora said:
I've been saying why for years here on teh Barf. But the small penis disease is so loud that it drowns out all voice of reason.

It's also the reason that I've stated in the other thread he should get a 65 rather than an 85. Not saying that what you have said in that thread and this one isn't valid on a different level of thought, but it's not really a better place to start because it's not as conducive to the learning.

Will--you will hear a lot of things here on teh Barf. It's almost impossible to weed wack through the BS you'll hear here. What your objectives are will greatly determine what you should get, and do remember that riding is a process. What you need today may not be what you need tomorrow. You can always get another bike.

Technology: The two stroke has a lot of advantages. They are inexpensive, light, can be worked on with basic tools, and people with modest skill sets. The four stroke has only one advantage--Honda doesn't hate it (fuck Honda and the Cub it rode in on).

Learning: The elusive answer to Rick's question (the one I keep repeating ad nauseum) has everything to do with how animals (remember humans are animals) learn. You have to be able to experiment (some call this play). If you can't experiment you wont learn (well). The smaller bikes mitigate much of the risk involved. By removing the risk you are encouraged to experiment (play). This dramatically increases your rate of learning, and the quality of your learning.

Fear: Remember how Frank Herbert wrote that "fear is the mind-killer?" What he was getting at is you can't do great things if you are stuck down with fear.

An example: take your full size bike out to the street and turn so that you crash it. No? Why not? Because you are afraid. You are afraid that it will cost a lot. You are afraid that it will hurt. You are afraid that you will look stupid. You are totally afraid.

Do this with a mini like a 65cc dirt bike setup for the track. Well when you get on the bike you are already on the ground. If you fall over it's no big thing because you were already there. The bike crashes so well it is highly unlikely that it will even get damaged. There's no fear. None. So what happens?

You play (experiment), and you learn. You learn quickly, and you learn in a quality way that allows you to repurpose your learning (training). You become a better rider faster and better. There's no mythological reason for this--it's all based on scientific research on how animals (humans are animals) learn. The only real issue around here is this message can't get heard over the massive roar of the small penis disease.
Click to expand...

ToraTora, thanks for joining the convo.
"The four stroke has only one advantage--Honda doesn't hate it (fuck Honda and the Cub it rode in on)."
C'mon man, seriously? It's pretty hilarious that you would write about weed wacking through the BS on BARF, and then make a statement like this in the same post. :laughing :laughing :laughing
The question I put to Rick was why does the 65cc translate to better safer street riding, as opposed to an xr100 with street tires (which is a much more economical option as opposed to 65cc with all the mods)? He explained it the best he could, and I accept that. Any additional info on the topic is most welcome however!
If you read my initial post, you'll see that you are preaching to choir.
I am also not concerned with size of anyones penis, whether they ride a Harley or a chinese pocket bike. :laughing
 
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ToraTora

.
Will Farnaby said:
ToraTora, thanks for joining the convo.
"The four stroke has only one advantage--Honda doesn't hate it (fuck Honda and the Cub it rode in on)."
C'mon man, seriously? It's pretty hilarious that you would write about weed wacking through the BS on BARF, and then make a statement like this in the same post. :laughing :laughing :laughing
Click to expand...

The joke should have been extremely obvious, but maybe you didn't get the reference. :teeth
 
D

drewnabobber

Member
I found that while I learned a lot about racing when riding the thunder bikes, I didn't learn as much about riding. The thunder bikes are great for learning racecraft because everything happens in slow motion and you can experiment with different lines and passing. But because they have so little front-end grip, I found that I wasn't learning as much as I'd like about riding the big bikes with sticky tires. When I switched to bikes with slicks, I learned just how hard I could trail brake into corners, and I got used to how far I could lean and still be at full throttle. It is more of a mindset then a skillset, but it made a big difference to how I rode big bikes.

But if you're just getting into mini racing, start with the thunder bikes. They are just so easy to ride and maintain, and the racing is just stupid fun.
 
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