I love this!
Looks good
Looks good
Any riveting experts here? Moto trailer bed upgrade
- Thread starter Mario
- Start date
JesasaurusRex
Deleted User
Looks good
Mario
Well-known member
Very nice document! Aircraft people have the best stuff :thumbup
Looks like recommendation is 2D. I aimed for radius of rivet washer (1/4") plus extra 1/16" for a total of 5/16" distance. This is 1/16" short of 2D (3/16 rivet).
There is a bit of inconsistent distances: one is my mistake, the 90 degree outer plate was installed upside down, the rivets have an offset so I can keep same distance from angle thickness plus inner plate. By installing upside down, you see the rivets right at the edge of the inner plate. Too late, damage done.
The other inconsistence comes from the way I tried to assemble this. Holes were marked and punched on plate, so accuracy of hole placement on angle depends on how accurate I positioned and clamped the punched plate on the angles. This doesn't seem optimal, especially on the one that was 90 degree bent, as now the punched holes will also depend on how good the bend was.
How is it done in the field? Are holes marked and punched on the work piece after clamping? or are they marked on the individual pieces, then clamped, then drilled?
Last edited:
dravnx
Well-known member
Drill your holes on the overlying piece such as your gusset first. I always undersize these holes by one rivet size. Clamp to your gusset to the angles. Drill through the angle using a hole in the gusset as a guide. Start with a corner, Cleco in place. Repeat in another corner, cleco. Continue until you have all corners cleco'd. Now drill the rest of the holes, inserting clecos as you go. Now upsize the drill to the finish size and drill and rivet one hole. Repeat for all the holes. Start removing clecos, drilling and riveting. This is the super accurate way to do it. You can skip the undersize drilling if fine accuracy is not needed but the key is to drill, cleco, drill, cleco until all the holes are drilled then start riveting and removing clecos.
Last edited:
WFO
When in doubt, gas it!
I use rivets all the time. There are many different ways to use them. They are a great way to fasten many things. They come in many different sizes. They are often easier to use than other types of fasteners. They don't usually come loose either and are easy to remove by removing the head from the shaft with a drill or chisel.
Mario
Well-known member
This is very good info, thanks! predrilling the piece before clamping means I could use a drill press and have accurate holes. I was afraid that if I pre-drill with the rivet drill, I can risk enlarging the hole once I have to drill again, but by drilling one size smaller, I don't have to worry about that. I think the rest I did about the same, drill, cleco, drill, cleco, start from corners to stabilize the piece as fast as I can, then move inwards.
Thanks again :thumbup
dravnx
Well-known member
This is where having a good air drill comes in handy. They turn much faster then a battery or electric drill and this allows more control. You'll get pretty good at drilling a straight hole after a couple of thousand. Consider getting one of the Harbor Freight pneumatic rivet pullers. They work really well and allow you to make sure the rivet head stays flush with the metal. The experimental aircraft guys will buy 2 or 3 to make it through an RV-6 build.
Last edited:
I read most of the tread but don’t think I saw de-burring the holes mentioned. If there is a slight bit of raised metal on the back side of the hole, your rivet will deform prematurely giving you a false grip.
I am glad you have Clecos. My first two years in the Navy I worked in a sheetmetal shop and we didn’t even know what Clecos were. We made a shitload of stuff and how we were accurate I will never know. I discovered the use of them when I was building a Sonex airplane.
As far as airplanes, some aren’t even riveted, just glued. I think it was a Grumman American Tiger I saw once getting an annual and as amazed to see many of the joints simply glued together.
Your second attempt is impressive and quite beautiful btw.
I am glad you have Clecos. My first two years in the Navy I worked in a sheetmetal shop and we didn’t even know what Clecos were. We made a shitload of stuff and how we were accurate I will never know. I discovered the use of them when I was building a Sonex airplane.
As far as airplanes, some aren’t even riveted, just glued. I think it was a Grumman American Tiger I saw once getting an annual and as amazed to see many of the joints simply glued together.
Your second attempt is impressive and quite beautiful btw.
dravnx
Well-known member
Good call on the deburring. There are a few deburring tools available but you can also use a large drill bit like a 3/8". Wrap a bunch of tape around the shaft to make it comfortable in your hand. The drill bit tool will get into some places that my other tools won't. I have a few deburring tools but his is my go to.
https://aircraft-tool.com/shop/detail.aspx?id=SP275A&AspxAutoDetectCookieSupport=1
https://aircraft-tool.com/shop/detail.aspx?id=SP275A&AspxAutoDetectCookieSupport=1
Last edited:
I have one similar to this. I use it on everything. It is so quick and simple. In aircraft we use it to prevent stress cracks. Not so much an issue with OP’s application.
Another thing, if you don’t think you’ll ever have to remove rivets, a steel mandrel aluminum rivet adds to shear strength...and weight.
Another thing, if you don’t think you’ll ever have to remove rivets, a steel mandrel aluminum rivet adds to shear strength...and weight.
Attachments
-
8975A5C9-D9CA-44FB-AD33-6379178ECA67.jpg
JesasaurusRex
Deleted User
Step drill bit works good if you're not heavy handed
Mario
Well-known member
Thanks for the tips on deburring. I did deburr the top side but forgot the bottom. I am using a countersink bit to deburr. I never had success with those handheld deburring tools.
Question on drill, I think I am going to make the investment on one (two if I really get into this). Are there any specs you recommend? I will only do 1/8" and 3/16" rivets. I was directed to Brown Tools to look at Sioux drills, found they have a closeout on one. Looking at getting this discounted drill.
Regarding drill bits, do you aircraft people sharpen them or just throw them away when dull? I bought a few #30 and #11 from ebay (aicraft store sells 'like new', whatever that means) and, while cheap, seems like a waste to throw them away after a few hundred holes.
Question on drill, I think I am going to make the investment on one (two if I really get into this). Are there any specs you recommend? I will only do 1/8" and 3/16" rivets. I was directed to Brown Tools to look at Sioux drills, found they have a closeout on one. Looking at getting this discounted drill.
Regarding drill bits, do you aircraft people sharpen them or just throw them away when dull? I bought a few #30 and #11 from ebay (aicraft store sells 'like new', whatever that means) and, while cheap, seems like a waste to throw them away after a few hundred holes.
sharpening drills is all about practice. it's not that hard and lots of youtube videos about it. i had a drill doctor for a while and found it didn't do any better than me freehanding on a grinder (and i'm not very good at it at all)
if you screw up, well the bit was junk anyway right? :laughing
if you screw up, well the bit was junk anyway right? :laughing
dravnx
Well-known member
That drill is an excellent tool for your purpose. I throw drill bits away. I mostly use cobalts and they don't dull when drilling into aluminum. A couple of cobalts will last the life of your project. If you can find cobalt split points even better. A split point doesn't walk.